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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6084584
12/15/15 09:27 AM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,062
Toxarch
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,062 |
No commercial rifle is truly all milspec. And you can buy a billet upper and lower with milspec measurements and tolerances, but billet uppers and lowers aren't milspec.
It is far more important to be able to hit the target than it is to haggle over who makes a weapon or who pulls a trigger.
� Dwight D. Eisenhower
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6084692
12/15/15 01:23 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 392
Budgeteer
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 392 |
Colt 6920 at G&R Tactical $850 and you're done. Add several quality magazines, ammo, and shoot it until you figure out your true need for either an Aimpoint or magnified optic.
"Hee cannot be a gentleman whych loveth not a dogge." --Anonymous, The Institucion of a Gentleman (1555)
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: cyphertext]
#6084694
12/15/15 01:25 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
milspec makes everything much easier. I would not own a AR-15 that was not milspec. I like the ability to grab any part and replace a broken part. Not having to worry if they will fit my ruger or whatever.
There is much more to "milspec" than just that... if you are speaking of part swap and dimensions only, then the M&P 15 Sport meets that criteria... however, it is not milspec. What are you talking about? Are you really talking about them not being full auto? Really???? They are milspec, all parts fit except the full auto trigger group. Wow really? Is this really the type of nit picking we are going to do???
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: Toxarch]
#6084696
12/15/15 01:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
No commercial rifle is truly all milspec. And you can buy a billet upper and lower with milspec measurements and tolerances, but billet uppers and lowers aren't milspec. Wow another one. I think anyone with average intelligence knows exactly what I am talking about.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6084790
12/15/15 02:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,021
pertnear
"Demolition Man"
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"Demolition Man"
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,021 |
HillBillyDeluxe,
Some truly excellent advice in this thread, but I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents.
For an AR entry purchase it is hard to go wrong. If you're the kind of guy that buys a rifle, shoots it a while then trades or sells it for something else, buy a complete rifle. Only buy .223 cal, a popular name brand & even consider paying a bit more for quality or features.
If you just want to shoot, have fun & learn about AR's, don't sweat your choice too much & go for a bargain. I like PSA stuff. Remember, a complete upper + complete lower = complete rifle! There is a sliding hinge pin that puts the 2 together! Most uppers come without charging handle & BCG, but I don't consider this assembly in that you must remove them to clean the rifle any ways. Right now with Xmas bargains you can get a good rifle for $500.
...and who knows, with the current political clouds forming, a bargain AR may grow in value!
JIMHO
"Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past.” - George Orwell
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: helomech]
#6084997
12/15/15 03:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 988
cyphertext
Tracker
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Tracker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 988 |
milspec makes everything much easier. I would not own a AR-15 that was not milspec. I like the ability to grab any part and replace a broken part. Not having to worry if they will fit my ruger or whatever.
There is much more to "milspec" than just that... if you are speaking of part swap and dimensions only, then the M&P 15 Sport meets that criteria... however, it is not milspec. What are you talking about? Are you really talking about them not being full auto? Really???? They are milspec, all parts fit except the full auto trigger group. Wow really? Is this really the type of nit picking we are going to do??? No, not even talking about full auto... Milspec covers not only the dimensions but materials as well. Take the barrel on my Sport for example. For a M4 barrel, milspec states 4150 or CMV steel is to be used. The barrel on the Sport is 4140, therefore it is not milspec. Milspec barrels are chrome lined. My barrel is treated with Melonite, therefore it is not milspec. You can put my barrel in a Colt upper, and you can screw an A2 flash hider on the end of it... it will all fit, but the barrel is not milspec.
Last edited by cyphertext; 12/15/15 03:49 PM.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6085032
12/15/15 04:09 PM
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Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 868
Txhillbilly
Tracker
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Tracker
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 868 |
I've been shooting AR's for a long time - before they were cool! Back when all you could buy was an Armalite or a Colt. If you're into all the Mil-spec crap,buy a Mil-spec AR. IMO,The only thing Mil-spec means is the gun will shoot Minute of Man,that's it. I shoot a RRA 20" Varminter,and a DPMS LR-260H factory rifles,the other two that I have,I built with quality parts. I've built around 8 AR-15's from parts,and they would all out shoot any Mil-spec rifle.
I would build one today before buying a factory rifle if you want the rifle to be the way you want it to look and perform. You can build a cheap rifle that shoots OK,or you can build a precision rifle for a little more than what a so-so factory rifle will shoot.
Guy's go out and spend $600-1000 on a factory rifle only to start changing things up on them to suit their needs/wants.The end up with a $1000-2000 factory rifle that's worth half of what they put into it. You could spend a $1000 on a custom build,and have the exact rifle that you want using quality components,and you won't have spare parts setting around.
The barrel,trigger,and BCG are the heart of any AR-15,everything else is just cosmetic.
Last edited by Txhillbilly; 12/15/15 04:10 PM.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6085113
12/15/15 04:46 PM
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 329
bside
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 329 |
Milspec is "good" in the sense that it meets the minimum standards of the .mil contracts. The thing is, .mil desires and requirements are not necessarily the same as an individual's, and is often lower than what you can get on the civilian market. Barrels are generally not freefloated on a real "milspec" AR and carbines have an m203 cutout on the barrel -- neither of these is a good thing. Triggers are invariably worse than what you'd get from a CMC/Timney/Geissele/etc too.
outside of the BCG (and I could make an argument that some civ bolts are superior to milspec bolts, but that's another topic), "milspec" is a red herring if you're looking for a quality AR15
Last edited by bside; 12/15/15 04:47 PM.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: cyphertext]
#6085263
12/15/15 05:54 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 33,349
bigbob_ftw
Big Sprocket Bob
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Big Sprocket Bob
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 33,349 |
No, not even talking about full auto... Milspec covers not only the dimensions but materials as well. Take the barrel on my Sport for example. For a M4 barrel, milspec states 4150 or CMV steel is to be used. The barrel on the Sport is 4140, therefore it is not milspec. Milspec barrels are chrome lined. My barrel is treated with Melonite, therefore it is not milspec. You can put my barrel in a Colt upper, and you can screw an A2 flash hider on the end of it... it will all fit, but the barrel is not milspec.
this is correct.
Ultra MAGA '24.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6086056
12/16/15 12:07 AM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,062
Toxarch
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,062 |
The best part of having spare parts laying around is that it gives you justification to build another AR so those parts don't go to waste.
It is far more important to be able to hit the target than it is to haggle over who makes a weapon or who pulls a trigger.
� Dwight D. Eisenhower
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6090252
12/18/15 03:15 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 8,913
HillbillyDeluxe
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 8,913 |
Appreciate the input from everyone. Was down to the Ruger AR-556 and the S&W and ended up picking up the S&W M&P 15 Sport II, the brand new Sport model that just came out that does have a dust cover and forward assist. It was on sale at Cabela's starting today for $549 and had to move on it at that price. I went thinking I was getting the Sport, but ended up with the Sport II which worked out great. Although it was a pain and took about two hours to get in and out, it was worth it.
Now I'm just looking forward to shooting this thing and seeing what all the hubbub is about with the ARs. Who knows, maybe I will build my next one.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6090387
12/18/15 04:43 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 7,863
Stoney
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 7,863 |
Appreciate the input from everyone. Was down to the Ruger AR-556 and the S&W and ended up picking up the S&W M&P 15 Sport II, the brand new Sport model that just came out that does have a dust cover and forward assist. It was on sale at Cabela's starting today for $549 and had to move on it at that price. I went thinking I was getting the Sport, but ended up with the Sport II which worked out great. Although it was a pain and took about two hours to get in and out, it was worth it.
Now I'm just looking forward to shooting this thing and seeing what all the hubbub is about with the ARs. Who knows, maybe I will build my next one. I never really wanted one till Walmart ran their closeouts and I got my Windham, for $349 I figured why not. Now I can't put the dang thing down. It is addicting for sure. Enjoy!!
BAKEN-ET's Pro Staff
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6090437
12/18/15 07:07 AM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 18,701
Roll-Tide
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 18,701 |
Congratulations. I was wondering if you got one.
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Re: New to ARs and need some guidance
[Re: HillbillyDeluxe]
#6090886
12/18/15 04:50 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 988
cyphertext
Tracker
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Tracker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 988 |
Appreciate the input from everyone. Was down to the Ruger AR-556 and the S&W and ended up picking up the S&W M&P 15 Sport II, the brand new Sport model that just came out that does have a dust cover and forward assist. It was on sale at Cabela's starting today for $549 and had to move on it at that price. I went thinking I was getting the Sport, but ended up with the Sport II which worked out great. Although it was a pain and took about two hours to get in and out, it was worth it.
Now I'm just looking forward to shooting this thing and seeing what all the hubbub is about with the ARs. Who knows, maybe I will build my next one. Sounds like you got a good deal. Enjoy.
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