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#6029870 - 11/14/15 08:50 PM A battle this morning. Me against the sounder.
FiremanJG Offline
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Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
Southbound on my county road, with cultivated land each side of the road I am cleared hot by the landowner. There is a tree line parralell to the road on the east side. East of that is 900 yards of open ground to the woods. My standard procedure is to idle the last mile to the ranch. I see something out of place to the east just west of the eastern tree line, cattle are out. I continue my idle southbound. All of a sudden I see a sounder of hogs in the middle of this huge field SE from me and in no hurry to get anywhere. The range finder I am testing will not give me a reading. Based on their proximity to an island of trees I estimated them at 800 yards. I pull the truck off the road, kill it, open the driver door and grab the bolt action, suppressed 7mm-08 in the passenger seat. I lay the forearm on the window opening, plant my elbows to my knees, dial up for 800 yards, put the scope in the middle of the sounder, and squeeze off a round. Peeeewwwww.......thump, one is hit, but does not fall. They headed at a fast walk toward me. The pace they were moving suggested to me that this is about to be up close and personal. I put the 7mm-08 back in the passenger seat, get out, open the back door, and retrieve the 16" AR carbine from under the back seat. I chamber a round from the 10 round mag in the rifle, and grab a spare 30 round next to the carbine and put it in my back pocket. The sounder is 100 yards east of the road, and 200 yards south, with a tree line between myself and them, now. I run down the road 100 yards, push through the brush, get lined up on them and started firing into the sounder, aiming one by one at the neck shoulder area of each hog. They push west through the tree line, across the road I am standing on, and continue west across the next plowed field. I jog west to get 100 feet off the road and had the sounder of 15 working directly away from me. I stop, gain a sight picture and start firing again. With each shot I can see a hog stumble and carry on. Rapid fire hog after hog and I ran the mag empty. Being left handed I can see an open bolt, I drop the empty, grab the spare from my back pocket, insert, hit the button chambering another round, and continue firing until the sounder hit the woods. Each shot hit, since they were never more than 250 yards from me.

I go back to the truck, assess the rounds left in the 30 round mag, swap it out for a full one, and headed to the tree line where they made their escape. I found blood splatter on the ground quickly and began tracking. I made it 100 yards west into the woods and saw that it continued to get thicker. Since I had work to do I decided to end the hunt and walked back to the truck.

Lessons learned:
I'm glad I am prepared for long range. I now know which range finder I can count on. For the second time a suppressed center fire rifle has sent the sounder toward me, instead of away, when there is a tree line beyond the sounder from the direction I am shooting. I am also glad I had a short to medium range AR-15 with me. It was the perfect tool for the job that appeared suddenly. I am glad I keep the rifle loaded but not chambered, and I am glad I recently installed an SS 1-6X, it was the perfect optic for the task. I am glad that I train and handle the rifles as much as I do. Muscle memory is built in, and thought is less thought than after-thought shooting and loading. Speed did count today and I think I had it.

I am rethinking the ammo the AR-15 is loaded with. I know I made good hits, but many hogs did not fall. Unusually, I meticulously hand load for all my rifles but the AR-15. I have a significant supply of gun show 55 gr.spire point and FMJ ammo. I think it is high time I get a serious load worked up and am thinking about the 60 gr. Partitions I have on the shelf. They are tough animals, and a hit does not always mean a kill.

I recovered one sow, and she went to a family in need. And I saw the buzzards circling the west woods about an hour after the incident. I'll have to continue the fight against these beasts I hate so much.

May also be time to build a 16" AR-10 crazy
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#6029967 - 11/14/15 09:48 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
Deadend Offline
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Registered: 09/07/09
Posts: 1956
Loc: Mineola,TX
Awesome hell of a hunt ,had to be fun to have a sounder in line of fire that long
One of these days me and my son are going to come see you ,, rifle aim
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#6030261 - 11/15/15 08:31 AM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
colt.45 Offline
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Registered: 03/16/12
Posts: 9307
Loc: wondering about the woods
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#6030297 - 11/15/15 09:01 AM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
Cast Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/14/08
Posts: 14901
Loc: North Texas - God's Country
I've been there with FMJ and it is not what you want in that situation. 60 grain parts are in my mags now.
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#6030396 - 11/15/15 10:05 AM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
Texas buckeye Offline
Veteran Tracker

Registered: 11/22/11
Posts: 2959
Loc: Keller
If you are not concerned with recovering dead hogs as much as just thinning their lines, the 55 fmj does good enough. Figure nearly every one of those hit will succumb to the wound, it isn't the most entirely ethical bullet for the job, but it will get the job done, eventually.

I shoot 55 soft points and have gotten very good results with them. A partition is going to work wel too, but don't expect every hog to drop in sight even with the partitions when rapid firing like you were. Anytime you are sending that much lead down range toward
Moving targets, shot placement is near impossible and it is not uncommon to have to put three or four in them before they drop. Of course, there will always be exceptions.

Good job on your hunt! Sounds like a lot of fun!

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#6030475 - 11/15/15 10:45 AM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: Texas buckeye]
FiremanJG Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
I refilled mags with 55 gr. FMJ this morning. You're absolutely right shot placement is near impossible. I'm good with a rifle but not good enough to make 40 perfect shots on a moving sounder in 90 seconds. I dont care about recovery I just want them all to die. same reasoning with the farmers that gave me clearance on their lands.
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#6031081 - 11/15/15 05:56 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
Afalex1 Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 87
Loc: Abilene, TX
Sounds like a great time. I wouldn't count on the 5.56 to consistently drop hogs within sight without near perfect shot placement. They are tough beasts and I've seen them get up from a 150 grain spire point from a 300 win mag in the shoulder at 75 yards. Sure, the 55 grain FMJ might kill them eventually and the 60 grain partitions will be a little better, but nothing is a substitute for a heavier bullet at nearly the same velocity. Ever thought of looking at the 6.8 spc or 6.5 Grendel? Much more kinetic energy.
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#6031469 - 11/15/15 08:24 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: Afalex1]
FiremanJG Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
I've thought about it. The 5.56 runs on cheap brass that won't break my heart so bad to lose. Sure I could run a brass catcher, but being left handed running a RH gas gun means it will be in front of my chest. I'm really entertainig a 16" AR-10 in .308. That keeps me from rebarreling and losing the 5.56 that's already put together. Gotta keep at least one AR in 5.56.
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#6031632 - 11/15/15 09:25 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
fill Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 02/02/15
Posts: 75
Loc: San Diego to Caddo Mills
It's a little more than just a re-barrel to shoot 308 from the AR platform. You'll end up not being able to reuse anything but the handguards and buttstock and a couple of other accessories.

If you do get into reloading check into converting your AR that you have now into a 6×45mm....basically everything stays the same except you get a new barrel. Ive got one and I load 87 grain VMAX's or 80 grain PSP. Man, they hit hard on hogs! I liked it so much that I built a second one in 20". Best part about it is that the brass is plentiful. It's nothing more than a regular 223/5.56 case neck sized up to accept 243 projectiles. All else is the same....bolt, mags, upper and lower receiver, everything.

I may be breaking my 20" down to build a 6.8 12" SBR out of it. If you're interested I could probably cut you a deal on the barrel and reloading dies, and I'll even throw in a few hundred bullets. Let me know, Wolfe City is just up the 34 from me. I'll bring it out and join you one night, and you can shoot it all you want and tell me what you think.
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#6031646 - 11/15/15 09:31 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: fill]
FiremanJG Offline
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Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
Look around new guy.

Check the reloading section and the rifles section. I've got more than a handle on precision hand loading and shooting, and know very well the difference in AR-15 and AR-10 chamberings.

I have no desire to change my AR-15 to a 6.8, but thanks.
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#6031662 - 11/15/15 09:42 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
fill Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 02/02/15
Posts: 75
Loc: San Diego to Caddo Mills
Sorry i dont have time to scour this forum to learn who everyone is. And didn't mean to ruffle any feathers either, I was just throwing out some ideas relative to your dilemma.

Just so we're clear... 6.8 SPC II and 6x45 wildcats are not same in any way. But I'm guessing you know that already based upon what your credentials are around here.

Either way happy shooting man.....get after em
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#6031681 - 11/15/15 09:51 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
Afalex1 Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 05/01/13
Posts: 87
Loc: Abilene, TX
Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
I've thought about it. The 5.56 runs on cheap brass that won't break my heart so bad to lose. Sure I could run a brass catcher, but being left handed running a RH gas gun means it will be in front of my chest. I'm really entertainig a 16" AR-10 in .308. That keeps me from rebarreling and losing the 5.56 that's already put together. Gotta keep at least one AR in 5.56.


Valid reasons. I've seen a few lefties run brass catchers from tactical brass recovery with ease just in case you do ever plan to get one.

I'm also looking into a 308 gas gun. I love my 6.8 and have shot close to 1000 hogs with it, but I always like getting new guns.

Keep getting after them!
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#6031702 - 11/15/15 10:12 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: fill]
FiremanJG Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
No feathers ruffled. I don't have a delema nor do I have any credentials. I know my options; try a hand load in the .223, or build a different rifle.

Yeah, 6.8 SPC would be a .277 cal, and a 6mm would be a .243 cal. Each are designed to run an O.A.L. to fit inside am AR-15 platform, depending on who chambered said barrel would depend on how much free-bore each bullet from each chambering would have. The .458 SOCOM is also an AR-15 chambering I was considering well before this recent incident.
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#6031706 - 11/15/15 10:16 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: Afalex1]
FiremanJG Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 17893
Loc: Wolfe City, TX
That's the company I have looked into. It looks like quality equipment.

No replacement for dispacement. The wider and heavier the bullet that can be pushed the fasted wins. 458 was a consideration, but round count in the mag, and price of components has me rethinking that option.
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#6031799 - 11/15/15 11:49 PM Re: A battle this morning. Me against the sounder. [Re: FiremanJG]
fill Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 02/02/15
Posts: 75
Loc: San Diego to Caddo Mills
If round count is another concern of yours then I wouldn't think 458 and 50 Beuwolf is gonna work for you either.

If heavier projectiles is all you want then you really should take another look at 6x45. No fancy bolts or mags or adjustable gas blocks needed. And you've got bullet options from 58 grain all the way up to 95 grain that can be loaded to 2.265 COL in regular PMAGs. And fits all 30 rds unlike 25 for 6.8SPC and 20 rds for 308 and 10 rds for the big bore soccom and beowulf stuff.

Those Nosler 60g partitions aren't gonna hit much harder than what you're already running. They'll just hold together better. The BC on them is right around .300. Run them through your ballistics Calc at about 2900ish fps and see. Those 87g VMAX have a BC of .400 flat. I push them at about 2800 fps out of my 20" and about 2600 fps out of my 16". That's 1500lbs of energy at the muzzle and 1200lbs at a 100 yds out of my 20", and 1300lbs at the muzzle and 1100lbs at 100 yds out of my 16"

You're just not gonna get that kind of down range energy with any 5.56 load. The 77 grain bullets will get you close if you run them to the redline, but that bullet you already know that's a match bullet with a paper thin jacket that is marginal at best for hogs. They work but one of ours got up and ran last month also.

Again you seem like you know your ballistics, and im not trying to talk to you like you don't already know this stuff, so hope it's not coming off that way. Im just sharing my personal experiences with loading for 5.56 and 6x45mm for awhile now. But the amount of additional thump that you're looking for probably requires a whole new rifle configuration for 6.8SPC, or a new rifle in 308 all together.

The Remington 64 grainer SP's in .224 actually hit pretty damn hard if you load them to max pressure, and hold together pretty well too. Might give those a look. SPEER Gold Dot has them in a factory load if you don't want to dive into hand loading them at first.


Edited by fill (11/16/15 12:31 AM)
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