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#5956024 - 10/01/15 10:53 AM When is a barrel 'shot out'?
Bbear Offline
Tracker

Registered: 11/24/13
Posts: 596
Loc: West Texas
In the mid-80's I picked up a 700 BDL in 25-06 from a pawn shop for under $200. No idea of the round count. Since then, I have put more than 2000 rounds down the barrel.

In playing with some new powder (RL 26), I, once again, found a load that prints 5 inside of 1" at 100. I then ran 9 more rounds over the magnetospeed and came up with this:

Series 1 Shots: 9
Min 2611 Max 2676
Avg 2634 S-D 24.5
ES 65

Series Shot Speed
1 1 2676 ft/s
1 2 2636 ft/s
1 3 2620 ft/s
1 4 2623 ft/s
1 5 2616 ft/s
1 6 2615 ft/s
1 7 2673 ft/s
1 8 2638 ft/s
1 9 2611 ft/s

I have been chasing the lands for the past few years. My COALTL is now 3.37-3.39 depending upon the bullet.

I have always heard that a barrel was 'shot out' when accuracy diminishes but mine never has. But seeing a load that should be in the upper 2900's - 3100's show a 400 fps lower velocity makes me think this barrel has seen it's better days and should be replaced.
What say you? What makes a barrel on a hunting rifle (rather than a target rifle) 'shot out'?
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#5956030 - 10/01/15 11:00 AM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
jeffbird Online   content


Registered: 03/09/09
Posts: 1710
Accuracy is the measure.

If you want more velocity, try a different load.

If you just want a new barrel, get one - lots of good ones are made every day.

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#5956038 - 10/01/15 11:04 AM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: jeffbird]
VAFish Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 99
Loc: Fairfax, VA
Originally Posted By: jeffbird
Accuracy is the measure.

If you want more velocity, try a different load.

If you just want a new barrel, get one - lots of good ones are made every day.


I have to agree. Try some other loads. I rarely get claimed velocities in my loads. Although 400 fps is a lot.
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#5956049 - 10/01/15 11:11 AM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
Bbear Offline
Tracker

Registered: 11/24/13
Posts: 596
Loc: West Texas
My RL 19 load is in the same ballpark with a 110 gr AB. frown

IMR4831 w/ 110 AB or with the 117 SGK both showed in the 2600-2750 range.

H4350 is 2700 with the AB in one rifle and 3075-3100 in another - same caliber, same barrel length, same type action


Edited by Bbear (10/01/15 11:12 AM)
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#5956053 - 10/01/15 11:12 AM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
ChadTRG42 Online   happy
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 9396
Loc: Lewisville, TX
Every barrel I have shot out has had 2 things happen, as well as other shooters I have talked to-

1- accuracy begins to or fads away. Groups open up. You will also see fliers happen. When my 300 WM went south, I was shooting a 700 yard target, and I missed by about 8 feet. The next few rounds were near the target, but you get unexplained fliers.

2- Your speed decreases. I was on the same powder lot for my 260 Rem, and that load ran 2800+ fps. It began to drop into the 2730's with the same loads and powder lot. I ran a bore scope through it, and the fire cracking was about 8" from the chamber. The first 3" was severe, and had chunks of barrel missing in many areas. Groups opened up with fliers, also. It had 2600 rounds on it, then set the barrel back by 3", and kept it 260 Rem. The accuracy improved, but it only lasted about 400-500 more rounds. And the accuracy was never as good as a new barrel. It would shoot a clover leaf group at 100 yards, where it used to shoot same hole. I will never set a barrel back again.

Shooting 1 moa can still be possible on a shot out barrel. But you will get fliers mixed in. If you run a bore scope down it, you can see if you have severe fire cracking. Fire cracking is 100% normal. It's the severe cracking with chunks of barrel missing, that will clue you in to the condition.

What powder charge are you running, what bullet, and barrel length?
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#5956063 - 10/01/15 11:14 AM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
QuitShootinYoungBucks Online   content
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 11/01/12
Posts: 6447
Loc: Lubbock, TX
I wouldn't think a 'shot out' barrel would result in a loss of muzzle velocity (or not much). I always thought that a barrel that was shot out started opening up groups no matter what you tried. I would suggest getting a couple of rounds, maybe factory, that you should have a good idea of MV and see how those chronograph. Also, you could have the gun bore-scoped if you suspect there is an issue.
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#5956161 - 10/01/15 12:24 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: ChadTRG42]
Branden Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 12/14/10
Posts: 1038
Loc: Aledo, Tx
Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42
Every barrel I have shot out has had 2 things happen, as well as other shooters I have talked to-

1- accuracy begins to or fads away. Groups open up. You will also see fliers happen. When my 300 WM went south, I was shooting a 700 yard target, and I missed by about 8 feet. The next few rounds were near the target, but you get unexplained fliers.

2- Your speed decreases. I was on the same powder lot for my 260 Rem, and that load ran 2800+ fps. It began to drop into the 2730's with the same loads and powder lot. I ran a bore scope through it, and the fire cracking was about 8" from the chamber. The first 3" was severe, and had chunks of barrel missing in many areas. Groups opened up with fliers, also. It had 2600 rounds on it, then set the barrel back by 3", and kept it 260 Rem. The accuracy improved, but it only lasted about 400-500 more rounds. And the accuracy was never as good as a new barrel. It would shoot a clover leaf group at 100 yards, where it used to shoot same hole. I will never set a barrel back again.

Shooting 1 moa can still be possible on a shot out barrel. But you will get fliers mixed in. If you run a bore scope down it, you can see if you have severe fire cracking. Fire cracking is 100% normal. It's the severe cracking with chunks of barrel missing, that will clue you in to the condition.

What powder charge are you running, what bullet, and barrel length?
+1 Chad hit right on what I have ran across and others I have talked to.

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#5956213 - 10/01/15 01:00 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
Bbear Offline
Tracker

Registered: 11/24/13
Posts: 596
Loc: West Texas
50gr RL 26. 117 SGK 22" factory barrel.
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#5956318 - 10/01/15 02:00 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
ChadTRG42 Online   happy
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 09/16/09
Posts: 9396
Loc: Lewisville, TX
When I run 50 grains of R26 with a 117 grain SGK in QuickLoad, I get a velocity of 2638 fps, and an 82% case fill. Looking at this data, your speeds are right on track with what I'm seeing. Plus, R26 is between burn rates of R22 and R33, so it's slower burning than R22. I'm showing about a max charge of R22 of around 56 grains with a 117 grain bullet. Since R26 is slower burning, it will have a higher charge weight than R22. QuickLoad shows a max charge of ~59 grains of R26 with the 117 Sierra SGK. I know Alliant's website shows R26 at 49 and 51 grains, which makes no sense to me. So, I believe your results and my calculations to be really close to actual results. I would keep going up in charge weight with R26 to get your speeds up. I do know this, you will be above 55-56 grains to get over 3K fps.
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#5956682 - 10/01/15 05:49 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
bull279 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 09/08/15
Posts: 672
Loc: Central Texas
In the Army, our rifles would see 20-40,000 rounds easily without serious degradation of accuracy. After 20 or 30,000 rounds (can't remember for sure which one it was, it has been while) the barrels get gauged by the armorer to verify the barrel diameter is still within specs. You can have your barrel gauged to see if it still falls within the acceptable limits. 2-3,000 rounds through a rifle shouldn't be that bad.
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#5956796 - 10/01/15 07:24 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
Cleric Offline
Veteran Tracker

Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 2579
It depends on caliber...

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#5956812 - 10/01/15 07:32 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
kmon1 Online   content
junior

Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 20282
Loc: Texas
What velocity are you getting from your old loads, these are new loads so there is an unknown. Agree with Chad at least from quickload data your velocities are pretty much what it predicts.
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#5956958 - 10/01/15 09:08 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
505ed Online   content
Bird Dog

Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 356
Loc: Blanco texas
QPQ your barrel, and you will not have to worry about it....;)

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#5957040 - 10/01/15 09:55 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
maximum Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 09/30/09
Posts: 1506
Originally Posted By: Bbear
In the mid-80's I picked up a 700 BDL in 25-06 from a pawn shop for under $200. No idea of the round count. Since then, I have put more than 2000 rounds down the barrel. . . .

In playing with some new powder (RL 26), I, once again, found a load that prints 5 inside of 1" at 100. . . .

I have always heard that a barrel was 'shot out' when accuracy diminishes but mine never has. . . .



so. . . . . .what's the problem ?. . . . .

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#5957079 - 10/01/15 10:12 PM Re: When is a barrel 'shot out'? [Re: Bbear]
Regular Guy Offline
Bird Dog

Registered: 10/27/13
Posts: 254
When you have the spare cash to justify having some fancy work done to your favorite shooter, i'd say the barrel is probably close enough nidea
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