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#5748523 - 05/17/15 09:11 PM anthrax corn?
JohnRussell Offline
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Registered: 05/04/07
Posts: 1318
Loc: Cedar Creek, TX
Anyone heard of a corn that is medicated to help prevent anthrax in deer?

Someone told me about it but did not tell me what it was or where to find it.

I hear that with all this massive rain, if the summer was really dray and hot before.. it is a good chance anthrax will be an issue and that by adding this type of corn in the feeders, I can help medicate the deer to protect them.

Russ
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#5748557 - 05/17/15 09:29 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
Pitchfork Predator Online   content
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Registered: 01/25/13
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Loc: Murphy, TX Dickens county
Hey Russ. As far as I know I think it has a higher chance of occurring from lots of rain followed by a hot dry period. I would PM stxranchman about the corn question because he is very familiar with anthrax.
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#5748558 - 05/17/15 09:30 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
I have never heard of corn sold commercially that is treated. I had a friend that used the vaccine for anthrax but used it on deer pellets. He treated the deer pellets for an oral dosage on a monthly routine. It amounted to like 8 times from late Feb til Aug. I know he did this for 10-12 years(IIRC from the late 80's till around 2000 or so) on the same ranch in Carta Valley and went thru 2 major outbreaks. The death losses in those 2 yrs was no worse than in the other years according to his records. Each year he found any dead deer he would burn each carcass, bones and all to ashes. Treated the vegetation around the site also. So I can see that treatment method possibly being used on corn the same way. I know of some people that used to use CTC (IIRC) in their deer pellets in years where it might be an outbreak. Some said it seemed to help.
From what my friend told me about outbreaks was it took very wet springs followed by a very dry June-July. Animals eating vegetation closer to dry, dusty soils where they can inhale the spores. Also biting flies were a key for gauging outbreaks also. Seemed like when they are really bad then you were likely to see an outbreak. The biting flies can also spread anthrax. Blow flies can spread it also from what I was told in that they are on a dead carcass then sit/leave their droppings on green vegetation around the carcass. Then a deer will eat that vegetation and ingest the spore that way. The spore can live in the soils for a very long time. When conditions are there it will make an appearance.
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#5748734 - 05/18/15 05:31 AM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
colt.45 Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 03/16/12
Posts: 9307
Loc: wondering about the woods
confused2 been pudding corn out for years... First time heard of treating deer for anthrax... popcorn learned something new... flag
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#5748865 - 05/18/15 08:21 AM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
JohnRussell Offline
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Registered: 05/04/07
Posts: 1318
Loc: Cedar Creek, TX
AAAahh ok, well, then I will not worry too much about it... and hope for the best.

Thanks for the input. I was sent a PM about this and had never heard of it wither.. heh

Russ
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#5749192 - 05/18/15 12:11 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
Erathkid Offline
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Registered: 01/19/11
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Loc: Dollas,Taxes Bluff Dale Tx
As much rain as you've had, the vegetation is so high that they don't have to get close to the dirt to eat. I did notice the animals were eating a lot of small liveoak seedlings, in fact they looked like they had been mowed. They must taste good. Talk to you later.
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#5750340 - 05/19/15 08:41 AM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
colt.45 Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 03/16/12
Posts: 9307
Loc: wondering about the woods
cheers since it went from 1 deer county ta 4... Been more worried about lead poisoning... Now gotta worry bout anthrax... flag
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#5750419 - 05/19/15 09:22 AM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: colt.45]
colt.45 Offline
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Registered: 03/16/12
Posts: 9307
Loc: wondering about the woods
scratch whin hogs started following creek ta food plot, corn feeders & the brick minneral licks had flush with ground along deer trails.. Started pudding minneral licks up outa reach flag
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#5752231 - 05/20/15 12:01 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
JohnRussell Offline
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Registered: 05/04/07
Posts: 1318
Loc: Cedar Creek, TX
Ok, after looking into a lot of aspects.. I posted this on my forums for the Ranch Property Owners Association.. might help those that hunt in the area, so posting it here.

Correct me if I am wrong anywhere:

---------------------------------------

Folks,

This is a friendly reminder that Anthrax can be a viable occurrence in our area, especially given the current weather conditions.

Anthrax most commonly occurs when we have prolonged and more than normal amounts of rain followed by a very hot dry summer.

Now, before anyone panics....anthrax is a normal and common issue in our region and does not guarantee you will have an issue, I just wanted to make sure we brushed up on what to look for and what to do.

1 - First and foremost understand that eating an animal that may be infected is NOT going to kill you, necessarily. Remember to always fully cook the meat as per cooking guidelines. Those can be googled and tell you the temp to cook meat.

2 - Next, spotting an animal that is infected. You are probably not going to arrive at your ranch and see a zombie herd heading out to eat your brains. Most animals that get infected die within 4 hours of showing signs. This does not mean that if YOU eat it you are hereby going to be dead as a doornail inside of 4 hours, it means that the animals, which are more prone to the problem, usually are found dead, not alive, but you CAN see them if you happen to be out and about.

The signs are acting lethargic or sluggish, stumbling, depression. Not sure how you would know the last one unless you happen to see one watching your TV and a re-run of Oprah....but there ya go. Stick with the staggering aspect.


3 - What to do? First and foremost, be safe. You do not need to go feel for a pulse or give the animal nmouth to mouth. Call the following numbers at:

Texas Animal Health Commission
Regional Office in Beeville (counties in the current outbreak): 1-800-658-6570
Austin Headquarters: 1-800-550-8242

And talk to them. Now, seeing a dead animal does not mean it is an anthrax case, but err on the side of caution if you must. Talk to them first, before you do anything, and make sure they know that you found one dead that, by all appearances from a distance, should not be dead. This would mean an animal that looks healthy, no scratches of any sort that would indicate a fight, no bullet holes in the head, no-one standing over it trying to add a tag.. you know the drill....things that you can see without feeling around it's arm pits...if it has armpits.

They will advise you.

During a hot summer, be aware that the animals you shoot COULD have anthrax in them and take extra care to cook the meat fully. Nothing wrong with eating something you shoot in a hot summer, heck.. for all you know they had it last year and you lived through that, right?

COMMON SIGNS you have been infected - Now, you shot an animal.. you field dressed it.. and you had an open sore and got blood on you. It gets infected and you see what looks like a sore developing on the cut. Be SURE and tell the doctors that you have been hunting and could have contracted some natural form of Anthrax. Don't freak them out, let them know this is a natural form as you have a ranch in the Anthrax zone in SW Texas and not a biological grade form you concocted in your basement. They can treat you with anti-biotics and send you on your way.


DON'T go sniffing the dirt around your ranch. Inhaled Anthrax, normal or not, can be just as lethal.

DO provide good food if the deer are having issues. Deer eat the grasses and forbs. This is safe. When they run low and start getting close to the really dry dirt around the forbs is when they stand a chance of contracting natural Anthrax. Providing and ensuring the animals have a good supply of water and food helps keep them from digging around in the dirt to find more. That does not mean you can feed them as much as they want and they will not get it, but you can provide some to help them through the dry spells and possibly reduce the risk.

REMEMBER - Anthrax is normal.. and cannot be avoided in this region.. but be SAFE, not fearful. Be watchful, and you can help prevent an outbreak.

If you have questions, contact TXPD or the numbers listed above.



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#5752324 - 05/20/15 01:03 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
Erathkid Offline
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Registered: 01/19/11
Posts: 14616
Loc: Dollas,Taxes Bluff Dale Tx
Oprah clap
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#5752563 - 05/20/15 04:02 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
ccrock Offline
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Registered: 03/09/12
Posts: 588
Loc: Midland hunt Val Verde
So if you are feeding corn in a feeder and throwing on the ground does that increase those odds?

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#5752655 - 05/20/15 05:13 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
JohnRussell Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 05/04/07
Posts: 1318
Loc: Cedar Creek, TX
I would assume it does increase the odds, if you are throwing it on dirt.

But.. I am not an authority.. I just pulled this sort of information off multiple websites.

Russ
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#5752751 - 05/20/15 06:08 PM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: ccrock]
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi

Registered: 08/04/10
Posts: 52092
Originally Posted By: ccrock
So if you are feeding corn in a feeder and throwing on the ground does that increase those odds?

Yes it can but not that much more than a deer grazing very short forb or grass growth that is close to the ground. The worst times are in summer months it seems. By deer season when temperatures are cooler then it is not likely to be a problem since the anthrax will be dormant. If you find a buck that has died in velvet this summer or early fall then I would not pick up the skull/antlers to bring them home. Anthrax spore can be in the bone or antlers. Do not salvage in deer bones or antlers if there was an outbreak. I have also seen and talked to ranchers that have it on their land and their neighbors don't or vice versa. A lot depends on past vaccination regime on livestock and burning of carcass to kill the spore. There are known ranches and areas that will get it if there is an outbreak and conditions are right on those locations.
Here is link with FAQ and answers.
https://www.dshs.state.tx.us/idcu/disease/anthrax/information/faqs/
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#5753567 - 05/21/15 09:00 AM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
tx_biologist Offline
Light Foot

Registered: 10/09/14
Posts: 39
Loc: Rocksprings, Texas
A lot of good info out already, but a few more insights.

Move feeding sites, especially corn. Spores do accumulate at those sites. An LSU PhD spent a lot time in my area studying anthrax. Its getting harder to use CTC in animal feed due to FDA and USDA regs. Requires a Vet's prescription. A note on antibiotic- feed it has risks such as breeding a disease resistant strain of another bacteria, or not be effective when used in feed as a lot of animals don't consume medicated because everything else on the ground. I guess it can be looked as insurance but it is a gamble. Most areas are ok in the state but anthrax has been discovered on all the state's counties. Some are more prone to have it because of soil, temperature and rainfall patterns. Those being Edwards, Val Verde, Uvalde, Kinney, Sutton, Crockett, Northern Maverick, Real almost yearly. Heavy rainfall followed by an intense dry out period of 95+ degrees usually causes issues coupled with high deer numbers. These are usually the what i call localized outbreaks occurring on individual ranches sometimes with 80% mortality. Warm wet periods usually can be worse with regional outbreaks that cover multiple counties. 2001,2005,2008,2009,2012,2014 have been the years i have seen anthrax in my area. 01 and 05 being regional and very bad. They usually come in 10 year interval and we are due.

A lot is not known of how it spreads but here are a few observations over the years I have seen. Flies both biting and blow,house flies. Contact between deer WTD are very sociable at feeding sites. Hogs wallowing in contaminated mud moving it to another waterhole. Forbs and young grasses have either the actual spore from emerging from the soil or as droppings from flies around a contaminated site. Biting flies could bite an infected deer and be interrupted before it has finished then bite an uninfected deer and spread it though its proboscis. And it is possible to transmit it to a human by the bite. Most deer die due to gastrointestinal (Bloat) distress (eating forbs), slow death 24-72 hours. Possible the least is inhalation its 1-2 hours. Cutaneous (fly bites) up to 7 days.

The biggest issue it to many deer- high densities ease the rate of spread. Many times i have seen high fenced well managed ranches get hit hard and the disease has little effect on the outside.

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#5770258 - 06/02/15 09:47 AM Re: anthrax corn? [Re: JohnRussell]
colt.45 Offline
THF Trophy Hunter

Registered: 03/16/12
Posts: 9307
Loc: wondering about the woods
scratch Please explain what the anthrax threat is all about, for us simple folks scratch okay for me ... It had me worried when it went 4 deer county.. Don't do no good ta complain... Seeing less hog's.. Even with the floods, hunten pressure... My ta goto place for a hog ta grill & chill is the WMA down the road... With the limited hunting, no baiting, ( use of corn ) no night time hog hunts, basicly 3 months for general hog hunts... Even an amiture hunter like me could find a hog, my problem, shoot more with camera than rifle... Finding hogs was easy part, work was back packing em out.. Been pudding my minneral blocks up off ground cause hogs get at em, an with flood they'll be moving ta higher ground... Still waiting... havent head of any one complaining of hog problems for years though... flag
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