It is the point, BPS and Cabela's is full of crappy product and terrible service, this is not to be argued in the macro, unless you are their target market segment. This does not by default imply Hornady is crap just because they are part of their retail space.

I would really like to know where you pull that 95% figure out of your [censored]? I would have to say America is doing exactly the opposite of what you say by utilizing the Amazons, Zappo's, etc.

The closest Cabelas is 40 Miles which represents a cost .55x40, which equals $22 per trip. I have not encountered a shipping charge from Dillon for that amount ever, not counting the time suck, which guess what you only have so much on earth of? Time.

Now, there is formula which you objectively judge in a numerical way called part worth utility/conjoint analysis, which will assist anyone in evaluating products on your own instead of internet bs. Of course, it requires intellectual honesty.


Hornady Actual Cost-

$58*.0825 (sales tax)+22.00(Mileage)=$84.785

This does take into account time which I mentioned above, I value my time, and driving to Cabelas and dealing with the assclowns is a time suck.

I really could care less about Hornady v Dillon, either works, my argument is very simple. If you are going to judge products, judge the actual cost through an objective lens and don't skew it one way or the other. Intellectual Honesty.

Cabelas Sucks.

Wow troll. Im helping the OP, but you come here to insult and attack.

Can I play since I too have both a Dillon 650 and a Hornady L-N-L progressive?
I really don't have much to say about which is better as I have already posted that on the first page of this thread but thought I would say I do like having the option to buy a Hornady case feeder 15 minutes from my door at my local Cabelas.... I did.
While I admit I buy a lot of stuff online I also like to take advantage of great buys at my local outlets when possible. A week or so ago they had all sizes of primers for 17.99 per thousand and I stocked up.... Cannot buy them that cheap anywhere online after hazmat. I have for the most part gotten good service at Cabelas and they sell a lot of quailty products from my experiences. In fact while in a Cabelas one particular salesman told me during the great powder shortage where to find a good selection of powder and the prices are the same as Powder Valley. I have picked up over a dozen 8 lb containers there over the last few months and all were as cheap or cheaper than Powder Valley.
So having to visit a Cabelas is not that bad of a way spend a few minutes IMHO.

I started out reloading 27yrs ago with a Hornady Proejctor, and it was a tinkerer's paradise. When I recently got back into reloading, I decided I wanted to spend more time actually reloading and less time tinkering with the equipement. So, I purchased a Dillon XL650.

I love my 650, and it doesn't require constant tinkering to keep it running smooth.

The down side of any Dillon press is it's addictive and not cheap. If the wife only knew how much I've already spent on toolheads, caliber conversions, dies, and dillon trimmer........I would be in big trouble

If you are just starting out, then get a Dillon 550 or Hornady LNL. But if you been reloading for a while and want a solid progressive press, then get a XL650.

I would not recommend a Dillon 1050 unless your are a hardcore reloader or in the ammo buisness.

Wow troll. Im helping the OP, but you come here to insult and attack. [/quote]

Troll? I pointed out information regarding cost, along with a time accepted evaluation process. What I wrote is insulting and attacking? The only people I insulted were BPS/Cabelas.

If you think this was a personal attack, your skin is little thin. Please take note I did not refer to you by any name unlike you.

OP - ignore the Dillon snob.

From an owner of a Dillon 650 and a Hornady lock N load. Both are equal quality. The hornady is a lot easier to set up. I do not recommend a four station obsolete Dillon 550 press which is manually indexing. You'll wish you'd bought an auto indexing in six months.

All progressive presses require some adjustment over time. In my case Ive had to adjust my Dillon more than the Hornady.

Local merchants stock Hornady parts and almost no one stocks Dillon. This could indicate dillon is on the way out. You'll spend more money on dillon caliber changes than Hornady by buying local (unless your vehicle gets 5mpg and you live 40 miles away).

When I bought parts for my dillon for caliber changes it was a minimum of around 200 dollars per change with the stuff I require. On the hornady its about an 90 dollars for what I require (bought locally), cheaper than mail order even with tax and gas vs shipping

Could you please point out any Dillon Snob on this thread, and said proof of bias or snobbery?

Look I started this post for information the reloading press thanks for all the posts and information.

I load 45, 223, 300 blk and 308 on a 550. I have complete tool heads with powder measures. I load about 10-12,000 rds a year 90% rifle. I pay others to process the 223, 300 blk and 308. I see no need for any other loader for my application. I would like to have one press set up for small primer and one for large primer but I make do. I try to plan my caliber changes and load all my small primer stuff while it's set up that way. Then switch to large.

For rifle ammo do you need the auto indexing of the 650?

i don't have auto index on the 550. I load rifle ammo weekly. Loaded about 500 rds yesterday.

Need is. Strong word. I would skip the 550 because it has 4 stations if I remeber right. I prefer 5 station machines

650 and lnl ap are both hiqh quality. It really gets down to change over strategy

Very similar to what Gremlin posted. The priming system on the LnL AP consists of a shuttle tray that grabs the primer from the internal priming tube and slides it into place. A plunger on the bottom of the press seats the primer on the return stroke of the ram. Sounds great in theory, and looks great on paper.

However, the main issues I had were the following:

1. The shuttle and slide needed to be polished. Simple process to do (both are aluminum) to loosen the tolerances just a bit and knock down the machine marks. I also used some dry lube (moly, because that is what I had in arm's reach) and brushed some on. It really made a difference in how well the shuttle and slide operated.

2. The primer tube is an aluminum tube that has a machined shoulder on one end that sits in a housing at the bottom that holds the slide in. Easy to put together, easy to change calibers and primer sizes this way. Unfortunatly, for me anyway, the inertia and friction of the subplate going up and down with each stroke would eventually work the internal priming tube loose - this caused the primers to not be neatly stacked up and ultimately caused a system shutdown. I fixed this by simply getting another housing and using some epoxy to secure the priming tubes to each housing - essentially I made two complete assemblies (one for small primers, one for large). The drawback (and it is hardly considered as such by me) is that during a primer change I have to unbolt the housing from the subplate. Not a huge issue because it's a single allen headed bolt, and I have a wrench that sits on the bench specifically for this press anyway. I don't think it takes any longer to change primer sizes over, and it is infinitely better than what Hornady has designed. I thought about doing what Gremlin posted, even thought about threading the bottom of the primer tubes and the interior of the shuttle so that they threaded in, but this was a simpler process.

Primer tube housing as installed on sub plate:


Epoxied primer tube housing and primer tube:


The other thing that I did was switch out the old primer seater ram with the new design. The old design was shaped like an I if you were to look at the cross section. What would happen is that eventually carbon and powder would get caught between the bottom of the top lip that actually seats the primers and the shoulder in the housing, which would not allow the seater to return to the proper position. It would jam the press up. The new design is a cylinder shape that doesn't have the area for dirt, powder, debris, etc. to get caught up. Simple redesign that makes a huge difference.

I also take 10 or 15 seconds every time I add primers to the priming tube (about every 100 rounds, give or take) and use a little brush I keep on the bench and clean the shell plate and primer slide area. That 10 or 15 seconds pays for itself in spades by not having stoppages during loading sessions.

Ever since these little tweaks were done, I've loaded multiple thousands of rounds without any mechanical issues that were not 100% user error. Total cost for the tweaks ran me about $15. My next tweak will be to drill out part of the base under the primer ram and press in a small piece of round steel stock to eliminate the dimple. That really is a poor design by Hornady on that aspect that they still have not addressed.

I'd go Dillon because of their reputation for quality and standing behind their product, and because they are progressive reloading specialists.

Thanks for posting your tweaks on the lnl.

So when you reload the primer tubes you have to pick them up out of the flipper tray or can you load a new tube?

The press comes with one each large tube and one each small tube. Each size also has a pickup tube that you use to pick up the primers and then load them into the tube you have mounted on the press. These tubes have a little plastic mouth on them that you put over the primer (I use the tray that came with my RCBS hand priming tool - easy to load primers into and flip all in the right direction).

I got tired of having to stop and load tubes, so I bought 3 or 4 more each of the pickup tubes and start a loading session off by filling those tubes with the primers and having them ready to load into the press when necessary. It's a bit of a slow start, because it can be a little tedious charging each tube (from opening the box of primers to getting a tube filled is probably really less than 4 or 5 minutes), but it's not like it's all that bad. And once I'm done, I have 400 or 500 primers ready to go. Filling the tube on the press is easy as cake and takes about 10 seconds out of the pickup tubes. That's when I take a few seconds to clean the press, check the nut on the shell plate, etc. and then continue on my merry way with loading.