The problem with that is that a lot of the guys who can't shoot still want to take a sweet tailgate pic to post on their Instagram

#nofilter
#whackemnstackem
#nothinbutgreen
#shootlikehelenkeller

Some will even voice that they can't shoot worth a damn and need help. Obviously if I am taking out two old men who just enjoy the outdoors and are past the 'I want to kill every duck in the county' stage then I'm gonna not shoot and just work birds for them. It's usually those bloodthirsty belly up millennials you gotta shot for, as the cap'n would say

And for the record I'm still in the 'shoot every duck in the county' stage

nobody enjoys shooting up a big group and seeing them all fly away, and when you have a group of guys that pick up a shotgun maybe twice a year it happens more than not

Such aggression!! I had to pull my minivan over to the side of the road to reply to your aggressive behavior

I'm looking at it from both perspectives. I've guided for pay, fly fishing and hunting. And I hunt and fish recreationally. Heck, I still guide hunts during season, just not for money. I spend enough time outdoors and have enough places to hunt and fish that I can typically put folks on birds or fish more often than not. Difference being I do it not to pay my bills.

I've guided fly fishing off and on for close to 35 years and have fished since I was 7-8 years old. I'm also a TPWD fly fishing instructor, but I don't get paid to do it nor would I want to be paid to do it. It's a volunteer position and I do it to for the sole reason that I enjoy teaching folks skills to enjoy the outdoors. Sure, I have the occasional student that is pissy or struggling, but regardless how they act, I don't let it affect the joy I feel when I'm teaching, when I have a fly rod in my hand and drop that fly on the X, make that perfect cast, land a really nice fish, or better yet, release a trophy fish to catch another day. It's a gift my father gave me and his father before him, and someone isn't gonna take that away from me because they're having a bad day. I just keep working hard until it clicks, and if they still don't get it, I work a little harder or spend some extra time until they get it. Seeing that look on their face when it comes together, hearing them say "I got it!", that's my goal. I don't lose sight of that fact regardless how bad a day they're having. I give it my best, the rest, that's up to them.

I can be freezing half to death in a 16 degree below zero winter storm waiting on geese to drop in my spread, and enjoy every minute of it, even if the guide is a jackass because he doesn't want to be there (it's happened, though I couldn't blame him it was so cold: ) . The simple fact is we find our joy where we make it. And if someone can take your joy that easily when you're guiding, then perhaps you need to say no next next time you're asked to wear your guide hat.

I don't mind the guide shooting if when he sees the clients miss and can't get enough birds. What happens then is the clients start bad mouthing the guide. "That guide doesn't know anything. We didn't bring home any birds. Etc etc".

I don't think they should shoot at the first birds in. Give the hunters a chance to get their "own" birds.

you're pretty high on yourself

Fly fishing guide...that's all you needed to read Mr Hayraker

ALWAYS tip the dog! ALWAYS! Even if the guide is an arrogant prick.

I personally think fishing guides should not fish.

But what if their sports can't set a hook worth a dam?

They're all judged by their stringers ya know...

Now you know why I deleted my post ramball. Somebody always tosses in the "expert" fishing analogy.

well, it's ok if they set the hook for their sports, just don't carry their own pole like aerangis does

I can definitely see where a guide may need to drop a few for some groups. I have been around the block a few times and seen a few groups in my time that need 6 boxes of shells to down 2 dove. In that situation, the guide may need to step in and help salvage the hunt for them. But, the guide should ask these questions before the hunt starts because I will flat out tell the guide that backup on ducks is not needed with me in the blind.....I am the backup! Like I said, when I get my limit, the guide can shoot in lieu of his tip. With all this said, there are trips that are just outstanding and need to be tipped....it isn't always the amount of deeking birds, it can be other intangibles. Lastly, I don't believe in someone telling me I should tip a guide because the boss only pays him $25 for the day. If you can't live off what you are paid by your employer, get another job!

90% of the best guides I know, do it just for the fun and it isn't even a business for them. I am paying guys up here $50 a hunt for goose/ducks/snows and get discounts for booking multiple hunts. He texts me the address the night before and I roll up 30 minutes before legal.....just enough time to park 1 mile away and walk to the blinds. You better believe this guy is going to get a nice tip from me at the end of the season.

Gunning ducks and geese is a team sport unless it's just a bunch of singles trickling in all morning. I hunt with a guide all the time, and it doesn't bother me one bit if he shoots, in fact I strongly encourage it. No reason we all can't have a little fun. I will say though, he does it the right way. He waits for everyone else to start gunning and then picks off the birds we weren't going to hit anyway. He's a pro though. You guys should find a guide like him.

I've been on two guided trips. First was in Wyoming fly fishing and we hammered the rainbows. Between four of us we caught over 100 fish and multiple 20 inch fish. Our guide was an irritable old fart who had obviously been doing it way to long. His attitude didn't really bother us though. I guess it was because we were doing so well. He got a couple hundred bucks even though he was kind of an a-hole but I just found it humorous.

Second trip was last year in NTX for ducks. We went on three morning hunts and didn't shoot a lot of ducks. The first morning we did well but the next two we only harvested a few birds. We got along great with our guides and I still keep in touch with them. They even invited us back to go do some bow fishing just for fun. We had one guide on two of the hunts and a different one for the last hunt. First guide got a couple hundred bucks and the second about a hundred.

We had a blast fishing despite the grumpy guide due to the success and had a blast duck hunting because of the guide despite the bad hunting.

this post is on tipping
IMO if I get treated well they get tipped well I do the same when I go out to eat.
as far as the guide goes I pay to hunt if I kill what I am hunting for then great
I would not want the guide to shoot unless it is a cripple.
That goes for anything I hunt.

I don't even see the relation of that rant, it's like 1.5 sentences about the subject then 3 paragraphs of tooting his own horn.

I don't consider myself an "expert" duck hunter, but more often than not I know more than the guys who are paying to come hunt...

A lot of guides shoot. Do you sports want 6 ducks in your pics or 12?
I bet some of you same guys saying a guide shouldn't shoot would complain that the hunt sucked when you got skunked ** aka couldn't hit jack

Nothin wrong with a guide playing clean up, if he really is playing clean up and not shooting birds from under his clients.

A guide tip should be 10-20% based on service.
Most guides I know work for tips. The amount they are paid by the outfitter covers gas maybe and definitely does not even amount to minimum wage when averaged out hourly.

A lot of guides miss too
Bunches

another good reason for them to shoot

Same here. Best ducks guides I've been around normally get pretty upset if you touch thier deeks also on set up.

Here's what I think about tipping.

Most people tip a waitress $3-$10. Sometimes that waitress or waiter can barely speak english (at least down here where I live) . So if a guide does a good job and you have a good hunt. Why not throw him a good tip, he did way more work than your waitress or waiter does and he will probably appreciate it a lot more.

Thats my .02. I guide and manage ranches for a living but I also hunt with other outfitters, some are friends and some are random people that I meet by searching the net but I always take care of my guide because I know how most hunters overlook the fact that a tip is not required but its good etiquette.

I will throw in a war story. Was to meet client in Parking lot at a chain store in Town X. I said be there no later than 1 AM. I should have known right then and there when the guy balked at the time frame. So I get there on the nose. No clients. I see a truck pull in and go the whataburger. An hour later 4 guys walk out of Whataburger and enter same truck. They drive over to me and ask my name and if they are expected them. My reply was "I was expecting you an hour ago". I told them to fall in behind because we are very late and we would be derned lucky to get our spot, no way to get the one I had planned to hunt.

So we get there. Load their stuff, ramp the boat and haul arse. We get to a flooded meadow and the dink dink dink of a flashlight hits my eyes. Client asks what that was all about. My reply was "You were late therefore that guy beat us to the spot I had picked out". So through the woods we go to plan B. You got it, dink dink dink comes the flashlight. The client says "Dang there is a lot of people hunting here. My asnwer was "You were late or there would be one boat load less hunting here". He asked if I had another spot picked oput and of course I said "Of course I do, I am a guide". BTW that translates into "You paid for the trip and you messed it up, you get what you get".

I set a course through the trees and what would you know, we found a good spot. The tree line was on the eastside of a meadow and the wind was good. I said "Here it is lets get moving". I set it all up and at daylight we had one bad arse duck hunt. I assure you this was as good as they could ever hope in their lifetime. We had nothing but color ducks ripping into the decoys all morning long. These guys could not shoot their way out of a glass barn. They each fired a box of shells, divided up a 5th box and then bought two boxes from me. That was 175 rounds and I ended the hunt. I killed my limit of birds but passed on the congrats to each of them, slipping shells. Meaning I knew when they were going to shoot, I fired and slipped a round into my weapon. I would say, nice shooting boys and send the dog.

The point of all this is at the docks they asked, "How many did we get"? the total was 14 birds. 175 rounds to kill 9 birds as I killed my 6. He seemed to be disappointed. I asked and he said "well we paid all that money I figured we would have left with limits like our buddies do." It didn't sink into him he was just witness to the best mallard pintail and wooduck carnival he can ever possibly hope for. It was that bottom line number he had stuck in his brain. Had I not bumped the numbers it would have been even worse for him. So I ask you, would you as a guide that was relying on that cash flow, stand up and tell your client the entire truth if they didn't want it or even know to ask it.

I liken it to this. People always tell me how aggresive water mocs are. I have been working with them nearly daily for over a decade and I can tell you that is a bald face myth. They are in no way shape or form an aggresive animal. I promise you someone will come on this thread and tell me how wrong I am. You choose who is right or wrong I care not. The fact is, I get paid because people choose to believe the myth about water mocs. They will argue with me (I would certainly put myself as an expert in that field) even though I know exactly what I am talking about. I used to find myself argueing with a guy about to hand me cash. I used to try and tell them the truth about water mocs. That is a true definition of insanity. So now, if you ask I will tell you all you want to hear about the truth. But for the average joe blow schmo know it all, my answer is "Yep and them sumbeaches will ball up in a ball and attack you". I just run right along the bullcorn spreader. I am truly amazed at how humans perpetuate these stupid myths.

Dang I guess I was bored. That is kind of long.