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Savage 116
#5578868
02/02/15 11:46 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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I've acquired one of these and it is giving me about 4-5 inch 5-shot groups at 100 yards. Not counting handloading, what are the steps I should take to make this thing sub-moa?
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5578895
02/02/15 11:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,973
bjones2571
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Check your scope and mount. Have someone else shoot it to confirm inaccuracy. Try different ammo. If none of those help, and gun is new, call Savage. If not new, have barrel inspected/recrowned and bed action.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5578901
02/02/15 11:57 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 22,691
BigPig
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5578908
02/03/15 12:00 AM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
J.G.
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What's it chambered in? What stock is it wearing? What position were you shooting from? What was supporting the rifle? Is the barrel free-floated? Are the action screws tight? What's the twist rate, and what bullet weight are you running? What base, rings, and scope?
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5578983
02/03/15 12:36 AM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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7mm Rem. Mag. I was shooting Remington ammo. I'm not familiar with the Remington ammo for 7mm RM, but this box was 150 grain and had a plastic tip.
The stock is black synthetic and presumably factory original. This is an older gun and doesn't have the Accu-trigger and in fact, the trigger pull feels like about 6-7 pounds. Do these older Savages have adjustable triggers?
This is one of those package deals. It comes with a Nikon 3-9 scope, in frosted silver color.
I am using a Lead Sled and can shoot sub-moa without one, so I'm sure the fault is in the rifle.
I think the barrel is free-floated (is that the way these come from the factory)?
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579001
02/03/15 12:42 AM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,083
J.G.
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So......much......wrong.....here....
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579032
02/03/15 12:58 AM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,432
TFF Caribou
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7mm Rem. Mag. I was shooting Remington ammo. I'm not familiar with the Remington ammo for 7mm RM, but this box was 150 grain and had a plastic tip.
The stock is black synthetic and presumably factory original. This is an older gun and doesn't have the Accu-trigger and in fact, the trigger pull feels like about 6-7 pounds. Do these older Savages have adjustable triggers?
This is one of those package deals. It comes with a Nikon 3-9 scope, in frosted silver color.
I am using a Lead Sled and can shoot sub-moa without one, so I'm sure the fault is in the rifle.
I think the barrel is free-floated (is that the way these come from the factory)? I'll address the things I know how to, and leave the ammo stuff to the experts. Take a dollar bill and wrap it around the barrel, it should slide nearly all the way up to the actions without contacting anything on the stock. I don't believe the older factory triggers are easily adjustable. I'd put a $100 Timney in it asap if its in the budget. Scope may be fine. I'd thoroughly check all the scope rings and mounts to ensure they are properly tightened.
The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference. -George Washington
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579086
02/03/15 01:19 AM
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 280
trapperben
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
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What Fireman said. Many older Savage rifles got criticized for looks but few for accuracy. The trigger would be an issue. Could be operator. Could be scope mounting. That is a good scope unless damaged. Doubt it would be that far off with the factory ammunition just because of the ammunition. First thing I would check for would be flinching. It happens not that I ever had that problem.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579104
02/03/15 01:27 AM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 225
RDub270
Woodsman
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Woodsman
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I've acquired one of these and it is giving me about 4-5 inch 5-shot groups at 100 yards. Not counting handloading, what are the steps I should take to make this thing sub-moa?
1st thing check the rings and bases for tightness. OR purchase new rings/bases to be sure. A heavy trigger should not be the reason for 5 in groups at 100yrd; case in point, I purchased a Stevens 200 several years ago NIB, put new tally mounts and a new scope on it, went to the range and almost needed 2 fingers to pull the trigger it was so heavy. Even with the heavy trigger, this .270 Winchester printed 3 shot groups less than 1 in at 100 yards, and is more accurate than my 1979 Rem 700 .270 ever has been. Let us know how the rifle groups after you check out the scope mounts. Good luck
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579178
02/03/15 01:59 AM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,973
bjones2571
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Im sticking w/ scope/mount issues Or action screw. But, you said lead sled. Ive never shot from one. Does that put pressure on the forend? Some of the savage stocks are known for being little more than tupperware. Check that the sled isn't affecting the barrel by putting pressure on the stock.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579331
02/03/15 03:11 AM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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Lead sled doesn't put pressure on the fore-end. I can hold steady, and the Lead sled improves this, if anything. Also, I am used to shooting a heavier-recoiling caliber than the 7 mag without the Lead sled and the Lead sled reduces recoil to almost nothing.
I'll check the rings and mounts and also the action screw, and confirm the barrel is free-floating.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: J.G.]
#5579338
02/03/15 03:15 AM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,732
HorizonFirearms
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So......much......wrong.....here....
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5579564
02/03/15 05:38 AM
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,773
Gone to Texas
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Tighten scope rings. Rifle Basix makes a great trigger for savages.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580417
02/03/15 08:37 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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Too late, I've already ordered a Timney Trigger. I don't think this will improve accuracy much from the bench but certainly will in the field.
Everyone is zeroing in on faulty mounting of the scope or faulty shooter, but couldn't the rifle itself be at fault? I understand the scope tightness is an easy possible fix, and I'll do that, of course, but, if that doesn't change things where do I go next?
Are their any drop-in stocks that guarantee a free-floating barrel, have a good 1" thick pad (the one that comes with the Savage is a thickness I've never seen before. It looks to be about 3/4" thick and pretty cheap). The stock itself looks okay to me, aesthetically, but then I'm no connoisseur of synthetic stocks.
BTW, this group I shot (from cold barrel) consisted of 3 holes, almost horizontal and about 1 1/2" wide and then 2 more holes, also horizontal, and about 1" apart, with about 3" vertically between the two groups. I don't know if that tells anyone anything, but thought I'd throw that out there.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580437
02/03/15 08:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 505
conifer
Tracker
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Tracker
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[quote=postoak]Too late, I've already ordered a Timney Trigger. I don't think this will improve accuracy much from the bench but certainly will in the field."
??????????????????????
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580468
02/03/15 09:09 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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When I'm shooting from the bench, I can hold a steady sight picture much better (and longer) while applying more-and-more pressure until the trigger breaks. In the field, the sight picture is going to be moving around more, and with a trigger requiring such a pull, there's time for the rifle to move off target.
If I've got an animal walking out of sight, I may even be likely to pull the trigger rather than press it in order to get my shot in time.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580476
02/03/15 09:12 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,432
TFF Caribou
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Too late, I've already ordered a Timney Trigger. I don't think this will improve accuracy much from the bench but certainly will in the field.
Everyone is zeroing in on faulty mounting of the scope or faulty shooter, but couldn't the rifle itself be at fault? I understand the scope tightness is an easy possible fix, and I'll do that, of course, but, if that doesn't change things where do I go next?
Are their any drop-in stocks that guarantee a free-floating barrel, have a good 1" thick pad (the one that comes with the Savage is a thickness I've never seen before. It looks to be about 3/4" thick and pretty cheap). The stock itself looks okay to me, aesthetically, but then I'm no connoisseur of synthetic stocks.
BTW, this group I shot (from cold barrel) consisted of 3 holes, almost horizontal and about 1 1/2" wide and then 2 more holes, also horizontal, and about 1" apart, with about 3" vertically between the two groups. I don't know if that tells anyone anything, but thought I'd throw that out there. If the barrel isn't free floated, it's an easy fix with a little sand paper wrapped around a wooden dowel. An aftermarket stock isn't going in itself to fix a 5" group.
The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference. -George Washington
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580480
02/03/15 09:17 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,443
aggiehunter03
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The Timney will be a vast improvement. That being said those older Savages are adjustable with a simple set screw but no where near as nice as the Timney. Have you cleaned it? I mean really really cleaned it; as in got all the copper out? Given that it's an older rifle it could be heavily copper fouled. Once it is clean you will need to foul the barrel again before judging accuracy but I would put my money on either your mounts or dirty barrel.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580491
02/03/15 09:22 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 361
p3ripperfw
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 361 |
Have you tried different ammo yet? Did you check the action screws?
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580514
02/03/15 09:39 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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Haha, sorry, this isn't a Nikon scope; it's a Simmons 3x9 with frosted silver finish and with vertically split frosted silver rings of a brand I haven't determined yet.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580534
02/03/15 09:55 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,432
TFF Caribou
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Buy a new scope. The nikon that's with the packages are good enough (prostaffs) I wouldn't run a Simmons if it was free.
Last edited by Tff caribou; 02/03/15 09:56 PM.
The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference. -George Washington
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580557
02/03/15 10:11 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
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I may do that, but I've gotten the impression that better scopes are better because they have better light-gathering abilities, are clearer, are more consistent when adjusting, and have better weather-proofing. I've never heard that they grouped better.
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580588
02/03/15 10:36 PM
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11,655
colt45-90
Texas colt45
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Texas colt45
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11,655 |
have you checked for any damage around the muzzle?
hold on Newt, we got a runaway
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580759
02/04/15 12:08 AM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,124
postoak
OP
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Re: Savage 116
[Re: postoak]
#5580910
02/04/15 01:54 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,502
RiverRider
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,502 |
Scope failure can cause the kind of issue you're describing. Sometimes the mechanicals fail and the reticle will bounce around from shot to shot. Cheap scopes are far more prone to failure.
In your case I would check to make sure the guard screws are properly torqued and that the bases and rings are secure. If the prior owner messed with the bedding, there may be an induced problem. The crown could be buggered too. After those things are verified I'd try another scope on it.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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