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Larger rifles #5522994 01/06/15 01:24 PM
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jhenderson Online Content OP
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Got a want for a big rifle that I don't probably need but a desire to do long distance shooting with a thump. Leaning towards a 7 mag or 300 win mag mostly because of ammo availability. I don't reload and don't plan to start anytime soon. Suggestions?

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523061 01/06/15 02:05 PM
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300 win mag in a remington sendero with a good quality scope would be my suggestion.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523119 01/06/15 02:35 PM
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7mm has better BC

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523121 01/06/15 02:37 PM
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Go with the 7mm and send me your used brass :-)

Both are great calibers, you cannot go wrong here.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523123 01/06/15 02:38 PM
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Any better reason to go with one over the other

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523128 01/06/15 02:41 PM
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Either one is fine. I like heavier bullets so the 300 is a natural choice for me though.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523135 01/06/15 02:43 PM
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Ammo cost is pretty close, great ammo for both.

7mm is my preference (obviously) because there are a ton of great, high bc, hunting bullets out there and it can do everything the 300WM can do

I would look for an 8.5-9" twist if you go 7RM, to shoot the super high BC stuff.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523137 01/06/15 02:43 PM
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300 with heavier bullets had me begging for a 7....I hunt with 7 now and haven't looked back.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523229 01/06/15 03:18 PM
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If you don't reload, 300 win mag...I don't like a win mag, but for what you are asking for it is the most available option.

Ed

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523244 01/06/15 03:23 PM
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I would settle on the type of bullets you want to use and find a cartridge that has the capacity to push it to the speeds you want. Any other advantages or disadvantages to individual cases would help to weed it down to one selection.

For example, I wanted a high BC bullet in the 160-180 grain range. That led me to the 7mm class. Pushing those bullets to 3200 fps or better led me to the STW. Not being a handloader left out some other options with slight advantages, but it was the clear choice for me, at the time. If ammo availability was a concern, I may have rethought it, but it wasn't. When I get into hand loading, I will be able to enjoy the full potential of the round, as well as possibly find an even better alternative.

At any rate, that's how I go about these things. For an all around, entry level caliber that would suit your general guidelines, both the 300 WM and 7 Mag are great. If you want something with more horsepower, then you have a whole list of advantages and disadvantages to mull over to come to a conclusion, such as availability, expense, brass (if reloading), recoil, rifle compatibility, etc.

Just what is it that you want, specifically?

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523482 01/06/15 05:15 PM
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7mm and .300 is big?


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Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523494 01/06/15 05:25 PM
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300 win mag and get ammo from chad


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Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523512 01/06/15 05:34 PM
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I've been looking for a 7STW, where did you get yours Sneaky?

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523537 01/06/15 05:52 PM
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I also prefer bigger bullets, so I like the 300 WM pushing a 225 Hornady BTHP or a 230 Berger at 2850 to 2920 fps. It hits REALLY hard. A 7 mag with a 180 VLD will have slightly less wind drift and shoot a little flatter that a 300 WM since the BC is higher than the 30 cal bullets. A 180 VLD is tops for BC, so it's pretty much king of the hill. But I'll run up against anyone's 7 with my 300 anytime. Both of these rounds will have similar trajectory to your big 338 rounds, if not surpass them. They just don't have the energy of the 338's. I have a customer who shoots a Savage rifle in 300 WM pushing the 230 Berger out to a mile and making first round hits on a 36" plate. For a factory rifle with a tuned load to his gun shoots lights out. That 230 Berger is awesome in a 300WM. The 225 BTHP is right behind it, and is half the cost of the Berger. I've taken my 300WM with the 208 A-max and 225 BTHP out to a 1780 yards, and the 225 BTHP has a definite advantage over the 208 for the wind that far out, due to higher BC.


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Re: Larger rifles [Re: spg] #5523580 01/06/15 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted By: spg
I've been looking for a 7STW, where did you get yours Sneaky?


ER Shaw. They put together a fine rifle with a Savage action, Boyd's stock, and their barrel. Lots of options. Bedded. Floated. Nice work. About a grand. Only drawback is the wait time. I think they're at about a year or better.

I've since put a Lilja barrel on mine, but only because I wanted a heavier barrel. There was nothing wrong with the Shaw.

The Sendero is highly favored in that round, but not always easy to find since Remington has replaced the STW with their RUM, although that is another option.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5523751 01/06/15 07:57 PM
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I thought we were going to talk about some big guns like 505 Gibbs or 500 Jeffrey, or maybe something a tad smaller like 416 Rigby.

Last edited by Colt W. Knight; 01/06/15 07:57 PM.
Re: Larger rifles [Re: Colt W. Knight] #5523781 01/06/15 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted By: Colt W. Knight
I thought we were going to talk about some big guns like 505 Gibbs or 500 Jeffrey, or maybe something a tad smaller like 416 Rigby.


agree

I shoot 7 Mag, 338 Lapua ... with heavy barrel and muzzle brakes, I can shoot them all day long

to OP, when it comes to punching holes in things I want to kill I prefer bigger bullet (diameter wise)
so my vote is for 300 Win Mag.... but you can't go wrong with either


Last edited by cabosandinh; 01/06/15 10:40 PM.
Re: Larger rifles [Re: Colt W. Knight] #5523920 01/06/15 09:50 PM
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Originally Posted By: Colt W. Knight
I thought we were going to talk about some big guns like 505 Gibbs or 500 Jeffrey, or maybe something a tad smaller like 416 Rigby.


There is a difference between "big game rifles" and "dangerous game rifles". Very few calibers blur that line.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5524459 01/07/15 02:03 AM
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I recently got a 300 wm ..... I thought about a 7mm as well but like heavy bullets

Last edited by tannerlst; 01/07/15 02:04 AM.
Re: Larger rifles [Re: JCB] #5527521 01/08/15 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted By: JCB
Originally Posted By: Colt W. Knight
I thought we were going to talk about some big guns like 505 Gibbs or 500 Jeffrey, or maybe something a tad smaller like 416 Rigby.


There is a difference between "big game rifles" and "dangerous game rifles". Very few calibers blur that line.


Well, that was random.

Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5527644 01/08/15 04:13 PM
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The only issue I see here that I think you're going to run into is that long distance shooting and not being a handloader cancel eachother out. That's not to say that there aren't some first rate outfits out there loading top notch ammo that will shoot long distance, but they're not common. To make matters worse, if/when available it's going to be expensive as hell. You really need a load that is custom tailored to your gun. Someone like Chad could do it no doubt, it's just another level of complexity that you need to plan for. Then finally to top it off, to run the most ideal bullets, like a 180 in 7mm the twist you need might not be available in a factory rig. Fortunately in your case, the Sendero in 7Mag with the the 1:9.25 twist should be right about perfect. So you can atleast check that box.

My $.02

Re: Larger rifles [Re: Strongbad] #5527675 01/08/15 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted By: Strongbad
The only issue I see here that I think you're going to run into is that long distance shooting and not being a handloader cancel eachother out. That's not to say that there aren't some first rate outfits out there loading top notch ammo that will shoot long distance, but they're not common. To make matters worse, if/when available it's going to be expensive as hell. You really need a load that is custom tailored to your gun. Someone like Chad could do it no doubt, it's just another level of complexity that you need to plan for. Then finally to top it off, to run the most ideal bullets, like a 180 in 7mm the twist you need might not be available in a factory rig. Fortunately in your case, the Sendero in 7Mag with the the 1:9.25 twist should be right about perfect. So you can atleast check that box.

My $.02


^^Exactly right^^

Of late I've been explaining to students that precision shooting and distance shooting is like a tripod. One leg being the rifle and scope combo built to do the job. Another leg is ammo that is tuned to the rifle so that it is extremely consistent. And the last leg is the man behind the rifle driving it correctly, reading wind, correcting for wind, and anylizing successes and failures on the last shot. What went right or wrong? Remove any of the three legs and the whole thing falls to the ground.

So my advise to anyone wanting to shoot smaller and/or farther when it comes to the gear is to gather the equipment to load your own ammo or plan on hiring Chad to do it for you. Very few mass produced lines of ammunition will hang with a precise hand load tuned to individual rifles. 7 Rem Mag with 180's @3080 fps is what I run, and I love it! But hand me a 300 Win Mag some 230 Bergers, brass and Retumbo and I'll make it shoot and would love it too. Both are not all that exotic (therefore easy to get brass), and both are some big medicine for just about anything you want to do.


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Re: Larger rifles [Re: Strongbad] #5529662 01/09/15 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted By: Strongbad
The only issue I see here that I think you're going to run into is that long distance shooting and not being a handloader cancel eachother out. That's not to say that there aren't some first rate outfits out there loading top notch ammo that will shoot long distance, but they're not common. To make matters worse, if/when available it's going to be expensive as hell. You really need a load that is custom tailored to your gun. Someone like Chad could do it no doubt, it's just another level of complexity that you need to plan for. Then finally to top it off, to run the most ideal bullets, like a 180 in 7mm the twist you need might not be available in a factory rig. Fortunately in your case, the Sendero in 7Mag with the the 1:9.25 twist should be right about perfect. So you can atleast check that box.

My $.02


Not always true, there are some factory loads out there that shoot pretty darn good. I load for a couple guns and shoot factory out of the rest. I have a 7 wsm that will shoot factory winchester ammo 1/2 moa out to 1000yds. That's probably not as uncommon as we all think. Increaseingly the problem with factory ammo is tha availability of your desired load. The minute you find a load you like the manufacturer will stop producing it, and your back to square one.

I think you are on the right track with a 7mag or 300wm. Both will do the trick, I like the 7 better for longer ranges (600+) but they are pretty close. A Sendero with a Jewell trigger is a pretty hard first rig to beat.


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Re: Larger rifles [Re: jhenderson] #5529771 01/09/15 03:14 PM
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Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there isn't accurate factory ammo. I'm just saying that typically it's not set up for long range shooting. More often than not they're set up with bullets that provide terminal performance above absolute precision. That means that you're typically shooting a bullet that is going to put you at a disadvantage for long range. Lower BC's (than say a heaver HPBT bullet for LR) are the norm. It might shoot very accurately at 100, but the lower BC is going to hamper accuracy/performance as the range increases.

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