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Reasons to shoot varmints/predators #5498823 12/25/14 11:45 AM
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Please rank these varmints/predators in order from most hated on your property to least and why? which ones u would mostly prefer gone and why? I know Hogs cost tons of money in property/crop damage. But I'm curios as to why these others are hunted often. Property damage? Danger to livestock (specifics)? Danger to wildlife (specifics)? What else? My dad has bobcats, foxes and coons on is place but he doesn't want to shoot them bc "they got a right to be here too" but he wants the coyotes shot on sight.
Also, if it's for trophy reasons or just to draw blood, that doesn't count as a reason for this thread.
1. Coyotes- i know they're a danger to baby deer and other wildlife, and livestock as well as pets.
2. Bobcats- do they put a dent in the turkey population? What else?
3. Foxes- same as above?
4. Raccoons- I know they carry rabies. I know they tear up feeders. I know they're meaner than they look. What else? Are they a bigger threat to turkey's than other varmints/predators?

Merry Christmas y'all!

Last edited by Theblakester; 12/25/14 11:45 AM.

Fast paced gregarious society forgets the healing power of solitude. It's worked thousands of years. Casting a line/gazing into a campfire/sitting in a blind after a long week is medicine for the soul. The serenity and peacefulness of it all is majestic.
Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5499097 12/25/14 04:41 PM
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Coyotes for the reasons you listed Seen many a calf killed by them and they don't do the fawn crop any good.
Hogs should all be destroyed with extreme prejudice. Being a land owner that is trying to rehab grassland only to have hogs tear it up really ticks me off! I hate them! I do not hate coyotes though.

Coons because they are eating the corn I'm putting out for the very small deer numbers in my area that I'm trying to help increase. Plus I will probably get some laying hens one day The coyotes and coons will have a field day with them unless I try to keep their numbers in check.

I've killed many a bobcat, but have recently decided to let them be hoping they'll help with the coons. But if they become a proble with the future hens I'll dispatch them.

Foxes I always let walk since it has been very rare for me to have seen them where my stomping grounds are.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5499130 12/25/14 05:08 PM
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Opossums and raccoons for eating my corn
Pigs for destroying the land
Coyotes, bob cats and foxes for killing livestock, deer, turkey and quail

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5499171 12/25/14 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted By: Theblakester
Please rank these varmints/predators in order from most hated on your property to least and why? which ones u would mostly prefer gone and why? I know Hogs cost tons of money in property/crop damage. But I'm curios as to why these others are hunted often. Property damage? Danger to livestock (specifics)? Danger to wildlife (specifics)? What else? My dad has bobcats, foxes and coons on is place but he doesn't want to shoot them bc "they got a right to be here too" but he wants the coyotes shot on sight.
Also, if it's for trophy reasons or just to draw blood, that doesn't count as a reason for this thread.
1. Coyotes- i know they're a danger to baby deer and other wildlife, and livestock as well as pets.
2. Bobcats- do they put a dent in the turkey population? What else?
3. Foxes- same as above?
4. Raccoons- I know they carry rabies. I know they tear up feeders. I know they're meaner than they look. What else? Are they a bigger threat to turkey's than other varmints/predators?

Merry Christmas y'all!

peep tis me again with my 2cents . Tis pretty mellow bouts varmints/predators de one dat bugs me de most tis them thar fire ants they roam in great numbers, distuction of land, chases the deer away from de food on de ground, but what makes me flameon tis whin they bit the kids & grandkids. i be pudding out traps ta catchem, scratch they be pretty good grillen if ya's dip em in chackolet, get ya some antacides though. flag



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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: J.G.] #5499477 12/25/14 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
Coyotes for the reasons you listed Seen many a calf killed by them and they don't do the fawn crop any good.
Hogs should all be destroyed with extreme prejudice. Being a land owner that is trying to rehab grassland only to have hogs tear it up really ticks me off! I hate them! I do not hate coyotes though.

Coons because they are eating the corn I'm putting out for the very small deer numbers in my area that I'm trying to help increase. Plus I will probably get some laying hens one day The coyotes and coons will have a field day with them unless I try to keep their numbers in check.

I've killed many a bobcat, but have recently decided to let them be hoping they'll help with the coons. But if they become a proble with the future hens I'll dispatch them.

Foxes I always let walk since it has been very rare for me to have seen them where my stomping grounds are.
my exact thoughts,don't mess with the cats or fox


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5499629 12/26/14 12:28 AM
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Just to watch them die.

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5499831 12/26/14 02:42 AM
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Well this is often a disputed question on whether or not to take certain predators an nuisance animals from properties or not. If you only have a couple hundred acres and enjoy viewing wildlife and enjoying seeing a rare glimpse of a bobcat or fox then that's great, but it makes no sense to let them walk if your just gonna be selective and shoot a coyote or or coon for eating your corn. Predator management is nothing new to me and from a biologist and a wildlife management standpoint here's my opinions.

If you want to preserve you quail and turkey populations you should probably be more concerned of fire ants than anything. Believe it or not the most detremental species to ground nesting birds are skunks. Yes not bobcats or any predator eating the adult birds it's nest raiders. Skunks, coons, and possums favorite foods are eggs. So if your under a strict game management program for quail and turkey these three predators should be at the top of your hit list.

Of course everyone shoots coyotes because they are about the most detremental to livestock and deer populations in texas, but if you think a bobcat won't jump on a fawn you better reavaluate your thinking.
Here's a few random pics that I just pulled off the internet






If you ask these questions to a high fence big money whitetail ranch manager and ask if you let any of these predators walk there gonna laugh because they won't take the risk of loosing a big money fawn.

Foxes do there part as well with nest raids on ground birds but for the majority they are mice hunters, but will take birds, squirrels and other small mammals as well.

If you are really serious about game management and predator control then there's no saying well I'll just take this species and not that one. There are strict programs on well managed properties to keep these species at reasonable levels, it's called predator control not predator annihilation, although pretty good trappers can put a dent in em and keep at a low population, you will never wipe them out, so if your serious about your property than install a real predator management system and start trapping to really remove certain species, but if your a weekend warrior who just a likes to be in the outdoors whenever you get a chance like 90% of us out there then enjoy the wildlife!

Merry Christmas everyone, those are my thoughts on the subject, enjoy.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5499849 12/26/14 02:53 AM
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And predation of coons by other predators is extremely rare, I don't know how many coons you've been in close encounters with but I'd probably been a few feet of close to a thousand or so and I tell you what, bout the meanest thing in a trap is a big boar coon, I wouldn't want anything to do with one if I had a choice to eat something. Bout the Only thing that'll touch a coon carcass is a buzzard, so I wouldn't plan on too many being eaten by other predators.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Txcatman1] #5500056 12/26/14 05:56 AM
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Originally Posted By: Txcatman1
And predation of coons by other predators is extremely rare, I don't know how many coons you've been in close encounters with but I'd probably been a few feet of close to a thousand or so and I tell you what, bout the meanest thing in a trap is a big boar coon, I wouldn't want anything to do with one if I had a choice to eat something. Bout the Only thing that'll touch a coon carcass is a buzzard, so I wouldn't plan on too many being eaten by other predators.


I was thinking the same thing, I highly doubt a bobcat will mess with a coon. Those things are about as nasty and mean as they come. Nice pics you found btw. Never seen a bobcat take a deer, but figured they would.

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5500265 12/26/14 02:51 PM
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I don't hate any of them. Coyotes eat calves, bobcats eat deer, foxes eat rabbits, that's the way it all works. I don't have cows but understand the loss when one is killed but that's what you deal with when you decide to be a rancher. I rarely shoot a bobcat anymore, not because I think they are rare and beautiful and need to live but because I have no use for a dead one. I have mounts and hides in the house already so what am I gonna do with another one? I do trap some coons around the feeders but not to eliminate them but keep the population down some. If a fawn gets eaten, well he became part of the circle of life sorry buddy should've ran faster.

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Txcatman1] #5500382 12/26/14 04:08 PM
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So an adult Bobcat would pass on a jeuvenile coon?


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501315 12/27/14 02:51 AM
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Coyotes if their is a food source like dairy calves dead cows can reproduce like flies then when the food is gone they prey on things close to home chickens, puppies, baby calves

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501325 12/27/14 02:56 AM
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I don't mess with bobcats or coyotes. I figure they are the first and only line of defense against hogs. I'm sure they take an occasional fawn but that's just the predator/prey relationship. I've put deer carcasses out with a game cam and seldom see a coyote or bobcat coming to the carcass. I have never had a problem with cats of coyotes on my cattle.

Now, free running rude neighbors dogs are a whole different story.

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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: J.G.] #5501466 12/27/14 04:14 AM
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Originally Posted By: FiremanJG
So an adult Bobcat would pass on a jeuvenile coon?


With other food sources available, yes 100% of the time, just not apart of their diet, to be honest with you all the majority of all the cats that I've opened up to check the stomach contents they've been full of mice. They are totally optimistic hunters and will take anything that comes along but a coon is just not apart of that food chain. Bout the only things that kill and eat coons are humans. Coyotes won't hardly mess with the carcasses either, pretty weird.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501667 12/27/14 10:13 AM
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Thanks y'all. I appreciate it. Any other knowledgeable land owners feel free to chime in.
My dad's place (Real co.) has lots of deer (5+, sometimes 10 does/spikes/fawns at the feeders at a time when they're coming in), cottontails and jack rabbits galore, turkey population has been strong (dad had over 30 at one time crossing his back yard pasture last year) the last couple years (probably due to wet enough springs/summers), 1-4 coons on a feeder at night, a boar or two (when the feeders are throwing during dark hours fairly regularly (sounders are rare), we hear coyotes but seldom see them on camera, a pack of wild dogs try to make their stompin grounds in the neighborhood every year or two, an adult bobcat has been on a game camera regularly who just had 4 kittens, a couple foxes being seen around, we see skunks but not as much as coons, lots of armadillos, field mice, and I'm sure some possums, though I don't recall seeing them on camera or when night hunting hogs, and an occasional porcupine makes a home on the property.
Usually, if I'm ready to call it quits for the night and I'm checking the last feeder I go to and don't find a hog but do see a coon or two I'll take one of em out.
Other than that I mainly hog hunt with nv and don't try to call in predators.
Given the abundance of wildlife and animals lower on the food chain, how would y'all suggest prioritizing the predator/varmint control out there????


Fast paced gregarious society forgets the healing power of solitude. It's worked thousands of years. Casting a line/gazing into a campfire/sitting in a blind after a long week is medicine for the soul. The serenity and peacefulness of it all is majestic.
Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501776 12/27/14 01:33 PM
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Take the skunks, possums, coons would be my opinion. Those are your top 3 nuisance varmits that won't benefit you by having them on the property, some cases the fox and cats help control mice and rat populations as well, so it is better to leave them, every property Is different, and should be managed accordingly, Sounds like there's plenty of ample food sources for the other critters that you should be ok to not feel like you have to go on a killing spree, so enjoy seeing them when you get the chance. But kill those 3 varmits, does you as the land owner no good to let them walk.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501813 12/27/14 01:51 PM
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All varmints need to be managed just like other wildlife. I take the populations down till they are no longer a nuisance or noticeable.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501910 12/27/14 02:39 PM
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neighbor dogs are the biggest problem that I have , they like to kill chickens and chase calves. Have a lame coyote that comes threw now and then , he sees me before I see him , he is hard to get. I thinned the skunks out a few years ago , hardly ever see one.

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5501950 12/27/14 02:56 PM
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All species you mentioned will respond in kind to especially on supplementary fed ranches. Just as you want to feed your deer all of those species will reproduce out of control because of the increase in a quality food source. Just because deer is your primary goal, these meso (medium sized) carnivores populations explode and all wildlife suffers. Most deer hunters don't care for lizards, songbirds, and insects but they are all impacted from increase predation numbers. With no large predators to control them we need to step in and thin them out.

Disease will become more rampant with larger predator numbers. Look at Africa at cramped living conditions and ebola. Distemper, Rabies, Parvo, Avian Pox, which normally affect only a few animals now can run rampant in a large population of close contact population. Seen that when raccoons start moving during the middle of the day, unafraid of humans.

Quail and turkey take it on the chin with the increase in with all of them,especially in nesting time. Take a look at ground nesting species, where high meso carnivores are present nesting success is reduced if not eliminated altogether. Coupled with a persistent drought in the Edwards Co area we have not had a detectable turkey hatch in 3 years. Those that have close to water run the gauntlet from them all.

Best advice, is to work on them until the numbers are few but not eliminated. They have a place just not in overwhelming numbers. Work in the racoon and foxes first as they are the most abundant, coyotes and bobcats tend to disperse more. Take them as they present themselves. You will never eliminate them all but only control what is causing damage. Keep in mind it never ends, you have to stay at it.

Last edited by tx_biologist; 12/27/14 03:30 PM.
Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5502149 12/27/14 04:20 PM
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If we all enjoy plinking predators we should look into why we can't thin the predators in the sky. The hoot owls and hawlks They do there damage on the young predators as well as the small game.

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5503083 12/28/14 01:03 AM
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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: tx_biologist] #5503441 12/28/14 04:21 AM
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Originally Posted By: tx_biologist
Disease will become more rampant with larger predator numbers.


Not sure what you mean with that. Disease in the prey species, or in the predator population?

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: RDub270] #5503538 12/28/14 05:13 AM
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Sorry I Meant without large predators. Disease has a way of controlling populations in spite of predators.

Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: taterpop] #5503653 12/28/14 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted By: taterpop
If we all enjoy plinking predators we should look into why we can't thin the predators in the sky. The hoot owls and hawlks They do there damage on the young predators as well as the small game.


Just my opinion, but predators from above have more advantage to harm the wildlife populations than opportunistic ground hunting types.

Have you ever seen a migrating group of Red Tailed Hawks?
It looks like a big swarm just rotating slowly a hundred or so yards up in the air. Then, all of a sudden, you will see one or a few dive bomb into a field while the others keep rotating, looking for a meal.
And don't forget the Cara Cara I call them "feral hogs of the sky". I'm not sure if they are indigenous or have migrated to Texas but I was told they are a protected specie (same as a vulture).
I have seen several on newborn/day old fawns as well as dead calves and an occasional dead cow. Every now and then, you will see 50 / 60 of them sitting in an open field or hay meadow and then another 50 / 60 in a field a mile or 2 down the road.
Why......I don't know, maybe the migrate...... but it gives you a great perspective of how many are on the prowl in that general vicinity.
Its only my personal opinion, but I would bet these claim more wildlife than a resident pack of coyotes.


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Re: Reasons to shoot varmints/predators [Re: Theblakester] #5503703 12/28/14 12:43 PM
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Quote:
And don't forget the Cara Cara I call them "feral hogs of the sky". I'm not sure if they are indigenous or have migrated to Texas but I was told they are a protected specie (same as a vulture).


Cara cara are indigenous to Texas. They are a protected species just like eagles, hawks, owls, and vultures under the Migratory Bird Treaty Act (16 USC, 703-711). Like vultures, they are primarily scavengers. If you are seeing them on fawns, calves, and cattle, something else probably killed the fawns, calves, and cattle.

Yep, you can sometimes see them in hay fields. You can also see all sorts of hawks that way, usually within hours after a farmer has mowed. It is a pretty neat phenomenon. They are there to eat rats, mice, snakes, shrews, moles, etc. disturbed/killed by the mowing.


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