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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: dee]
#5487184
12/19/14 02:01 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,954
ChadTRG42
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My plan is to make the 100 yard target above my line of sight to see my 300 yard aiming point and catch the groups on paper at 100. I will be impacting about 4-6 inches high at 100 with a 300 yard zero. I may even plan to impact higher at 300 to get more room on the 100 yard target. I'll try to shoot next week.
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: Cleric]
#5487226
12/19/14 02:23 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,954
ChadTRG42
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Wouldn't a Berger 230 hybrid also work? I think it's a hair longer... Yes, the 230 Berger is much longer than the 208 A-max. At the speeds I'm looking at (2400-2450 fps in a 308 Win), it shows a 1.05 stability factor. That's not enough. (Plus, this bullet is twice as expensive as the 208!!) With the 208, I'm looking at a stability factor of 1.27, which should be ok. 1.4 or greater is for sure stability, and the 1.3 area will also work, but is getting away from the 1.4 area. I don't like to go less than 1.3. My 208 out of my 300WM is a 1.35 at 2950 fps, which I've taken out to 1780 yards, and works well. The 1.27 should be ok. I think it's just right for this test.
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#5487246
12/19/14 02:33 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 6,219
dee
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My plan is to make the 100 yard target above my line of sight to see my 300 yard aiming point and catch the groups on paper at 100. I will be impacting about 4-6 inches high at 100 with a 300 yard zero. I may even plan to impact higher at 300 to get more room on the 100 yard target. I'll try to shoot next week. That's the way I was thinking it could be done. It will be interesting to see the results.
"A vote is like a rifle; it's usefulness depends on the character of the user" Theodore Roosevelt
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: dee]
#5487252
12/19/14 02:39 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 4,755
ccoker
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Just out of curiosity why the 208 vs 178 if it seems you are having challenges stabilizing it?
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: dee]
#5487258
12/19/14 02:42 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,954
ChadTRG42
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I think the lack of stability, or right on the edge of stability is what exhibits this issue the best. Plus, I've already seen this issue with the 208 in a 308 before.
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: dee]
#5487262
12/19/14 02:43 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 6,219
dee
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The way I read everything is that the bullet is the best stabilized leaving the barrel. So it's either stable or not.
"A vote is like a rifle; it's usefulness depends on the character of the user" Theodore Roosevelt
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: ccoker]
#5487263
12/19/14 02:44 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173
J.G.
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A 178 out of a .308 Win will print small at 100 as well as 300.
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: dee]
#5487310
12/19/14 03:09 PM
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 329
bside
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The wobble on a top is caused by off axis torque (OAT), which is the same thing that causes a frisbee (one of my other hobbies is disc sports) to wobble when released. OAT is defined as unbalanced force applied in a direction other than the axis of travel.
To explain further -- imagine if you were dropping a top rather than spinning it on the table -- the axis of travel is vertical and any force on that axis will not cause wobble. Unbalanced force along the X or Y axes will result in wobble.
How could this happen in a firearm? My first thought is barrel harmonics causing unbalanced force on the bullet (as it is riding the wave it's being pushed up/down/side to side) in a direction perpendicular to the direction of flight. poorly cut/crowned barrels will do the same by allowing gas to exit on one side of the bullet before the other.
(edit to add details past here)
Further -- just as a top and a disc will quickly lose that wobble if they have enough spin, the gyroscopic inertia of a bullet will self correct and remove the wobble during its flight. That straightening/correcting force is not "free" however, and necessarily slows down the rotation of the spinning object as force is exerted.
Last edited by bside; 12/19/14 03:15 PM.
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Re: Accuracy at distance
[Re: dee]
#5506445
12/29/14 07:29 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,954
ChadTRG42
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I went to the range yesterday to get started on this project. My first load with the 208 A-max out of my 308 was a little hot. So I need to pull some bullets and reload them. I'll try it again in the next few days.
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