Just got a new rifle in .260 rem. I dont reload but am going to have some custom loads worked up for this rifle. I have been looking at nosler accubonds and nosler ballistic tips. Any thoughts on which would be best for whitetail?

I don't like the ballistic tips for anything really.....maybe predators.
Accubonds are supposed to fly like the bt, but hold together like a partition. Gonna try some this season and see how I like them.

Either will work in it for whitetails. The 130gr accubond would be my choice and is what I use in the 6.5-284 with good results along with the 140gr partition. BTs for deer use the 120gr version, that is what I plan to load in the Grendel this year.

If you want to try partitions 100gr or 125gr would also be good choices.

Nosler makes a 100gr BT, I would stayaway from it for deer and use the 120s.

NO BT's

If you like Nosler the SST is proven. Neighbors shot four deer with my reloads and were 4 for 4

I've had deer run 1/2 a mile with both lungs punctured with a BT in .270. That was a one time experiment and short lived.

Almost my entire life I've used Sierra Spitzer BT Game Kings....and I've never had to look for a deer.

Accubonds would be my choice if you are going to limit your decision to two choices.

BT's sure do shoot well though.

I was really leaning towards the accubonds.They have them in 130gr and 140gr. Which would you choose with this barrel length and twist?

22" barrel
1-8 twist rate

Of the two the OP has it narrowed down to, the Accubonds get the nod from me.

I would go with the 130s in the 260.

Accubonds, or better yet Barnes TTSX

SST is a Hornady Bullet
Ballistic Tip is a Nosler bullet.
Have used a lot of 7mm Ballistic Tip Bullets both 140gr and 120gr and of 20+ deer all were one shot kills and watched them all fall so I guess I have just been lucky.

Thanks for the input!

I have had the same experience but figured it was a matter of time before one blew on entry and didn't penetrate. I'm now using Accubonds in all my rifles.

ABs are great. I don't fool with BTs under .30cal and still would prefer the ABs.

For Texas deer and pigs, I don't think it will matter much. Both will have a good end result. But if you want a little extra insurance, I'd go with the AB. Like stated, a Hornady SST would be a great choice, or a 140 grain A-max. The A-max is a great hunting bullet, and holds together well and is a great target bullet too.

Where the Ballistic Tips really shine is at lower impact veolicities like long range or in reduced recoil loads. Another is Pistols like Contenders or Encores where the short barrel yields lower velocities. For those I would rather use BT than accubonds otherwise I use Accubonds these days. But like I said above Never lost an animal to the BT and watched them all drop.

I would look at the 129gr SST. It's half the price of the accubond and performs very well on deer. I have quiet a bit of load data for .260 when you get to that point. Also there's nothing wrong with exploiting the 1:8 twist. Try some of the heavier bullets.

I have had outstanding results with Accubonds in 25 and 30 caliber and will soon be using them in 6mn and 7mm as well.

ABs have a sterling reputation and BTs not so much. I haven't shot anything with ABs but I know several who have and they all are very impressed with their performance while no one I know is really impressed with the BT's performance.

accubonds

Looks like its accubonds, hands down. Now that i know which bullet and grain, how do i choose a brand of brass? Or does the brass not make that much of a difference

I personally use Remington Brass, not because of quaility or anything. When I get a rifle, new or used, I automatically do a 40 round break in on the barrel. Generally I use Coreloks to do that, so I have 40 once fired rounds to work with and then top off as needed. Alot of times I can get two boxes of ammo for what they charge for one bag of new brass so I feel I am literally getting more bang for my buck. I will tell you this, do mix brass you will see a differnce.

It is not cheap but I like Nosler Brass. It is weight sorted, prepped and very uniform

Educate me here. How is Barnes better?

The barnes round carries a higher weight retention through the target. What I like most about this is I can use a lighter barnes round and get the same results as a heavier other. Take my 7-08, In an accubond I shoot a 140gr but in a Barnes TTSX I shoot a 120gr. The higher velocity and higher weight retention buts it on par with the 140gr Nosler. I used to think it was all smoke and mirrors, until I started shooting Barnes two years ago. I won't go back.

What happens when one performs like the Barnes that didn't expand in the thread last year?

BTW was anything ever decided on what caused It's failure?

I like the Accubonds better than the Barnes bullets. The weight "lost" that barnes fans talk about is not lost it becomes secondary projectiles in the wound canal which do further damage. The design criteria for accubonds called for a bullet that shoots like a Ballistic Tip and performs like a Partition in game. I think they did it.

I do not think anything was resolved on that failure.

So it starts out at a lower weight, but retains more. As opposed to an accubond that starts out heavier and might shed a little higher percentage of weight.

So, one could argue that they might be fairly close in total weight when each exits? Then, if the Accubond retains a larger percentage, it might even weigh more?

Still not understanding the overall benefit.

If both bullets exit, is it even an issue?

Also, looking at the trama of a wound channel, your lead bullets have more of a "shock" and larger wound area than your Barnes. The Barnes are good for driving deep and through game. The lead and bonded bullets have a larger effect inside the body than a solid does. I have many hunters that are switching from the Barnes to other lead or bonded bullets with great effect. I have seen a lot of elk hunters switching to the Berger VLD's for this reason.

It still makes it into the vitals

Barnes shine in fast light cals- where impact velocities push the limits of traditional cup and core. The shock value of a ttsx impacting over 3200 ft/s is pretty impressive

Yes. When you get up over 3000+ fps, anything hit will have a good shock. But the actual wound channel internally with a lead bullet will have a larger diameter shock than a Barnes will. You can also see this in ballistic gelatin.

and all of the died in the wool barnes shooters I know say that they work best in a spotless barrel accuracy wise. Accubonds run pretty good in some of my rifles( .45 inch 5 shot group at 100 w/ 140gr in a 270 WSM with H1000) But I cant get much better that 1.2 inches average in my 25-06 with 4831 and 4350 and accubonds. I am going try h1000 then give up and work up a new load with sme 100 or 115 partitions.

I had issue with ab accuracy in my 25-06 but excellent results with a tsx work up load that just happens to be pretty close to the nosler 100gr partition custom ammo that is otc. The 100 gr partitions are pretty impressive at 3300 fts

There's not I use the Accubonds since I prefer exit wounds and they are cheaper to load.

I had really good luck with them in my dad's 25-06 (.75" 5 shot groups) using 4831, its a fairly light charge at 2950fps but I was short on time and that accuracy is more than acceptable. Yours could be one of those rifles that don't like that particular bullet no matter how much you want it to.

Thats what i am thinking nosler is supossed to get back to me withh some h1000 data and i will try that. And then i will try partitions

And you hope that .308" part hits just the right part of the vitals to keep the taking dogs home?

Vs flesh wound from bullet blowing out ward on a cup/core.
As long as the bullet is rotating is still doing damage greater then its diameter.
I'll take the penetration over non any day.

You stick a feild tip arrow through both lungs the animal is dead, just not as fun tracking as a 2" rage

I just personally dont want to mess with a solid copper bullet, bonded and a frame bullets are more than adequate for what I need in my hunting loads. And cup and core SP, BT, or OTM have thier applications as well. When reloading for whitetail everyone needs to bear in mind that they are a light skinned light boned medium sized game animal that isnt that difficult to kill with a centerfire rifle of suffecient caliber and speed with good bullet construction and placement.

That's why I like the bonded core type bullets you get the best of both worlds huge wound channel and good deep penetration.

I am a fan of the partition in my 25-06.

But I'm a bigger fan of the 80ttsx in the 257 wby and 80 in the 243.

Now over 27cal pick a bullet I don't think it matters

I've shot between 200 and 300 deer with Nosler Ballistic Tips (130 gr in the 270 and 120 gr in the 260). I started using the bullet back when it had the thinner jacket and it worked just fine even then. It's the gold standard for hunting bullet accuracy and it's absolutely deadly on deer. Avoid quartering shots from the front of the deer and don't try to shoot through leg bones. Other than that, there isn't a more effective bullet. If you aren't getting the job done, don't blame it on the bullet.

X2 on the nosler custom comp brass. I will not say that it is better than the Lapua brass but it is definately more user friendly

I've thought about giving the 80gr Barnes a try in my dad's 25-06 but after his results with the 110gr Accubonds he won't try anything else.

So it looks like i will start with a 130gr Accubond and nosler custom brass. Hopefully he can work something up that will shoot well for me. I got one last question and i will be ready to go.

The gunsmith that is working up the loads will be breaking in the barrel for me. Is there any benefit in using the custom ammo for this? I will be charged extra for bullets and brass. If its not required ill have him do the break in with something much cheaper.

No need for the expensive stuff for barrel breakin IMO

Only deer I have ever shot and not recovered was from a 140gr Nosler BT. He is still alive and has a big lump up and over the top of his left shoulder. I'll pass.

I never said my 7-08 liked the barnes better than the accubond, the accubond actually shoots better groups out of it by almost 1/4" (3/4 vs 1/2). I just like the fact that every deer I have shot with the TSX and TTSX was DRT, and no meat was damaged from the bullet breaking up like you guys seem to perfer. I do hunt with an accubond when I carry my 25-06 110gr. But in my 7mm-08 and 7 mag I shoot 120gr TTSX and in my 22-250 I shoot 53gr TSX.
If I am hunting larger than whitetail, I prefer a 175gr Nosler Partition or Swift A-Frame out of my 7 Mag.

That big lump over the top of the shoulder is not a problem of poor bullet performance, it is most likely the result of poor shot placement. I bet if you kill that deer you will find you hit high above the vitals and no bullet would have been effective.

my bro shot a buck like that with 150gr hornady SP @ about 200yds (300wm)... pin hole for an entrance and a hole as big as your fist for an exit. It was by luck he ended up killing that deer, but it required 00-buck & some knife work to actually kill him hours later.

Have one on the wall that was shot the previous yeat with a 30-06 180gr corlocks high in shoulder area, too high though. There was an entry and exit hole, a big knot and a cavity bigger than my fist above the back gristled around it with bone fragments in the gristle. The deer was shot the year before less than 100 yards from where I killed him.

165 grain ballistic tips used forever no probs,out of my 30-06.

This one went straight down and ended up getting up when we went back inside for the 4wheeler key. Found him bedded about 150 TSS away along a 4wheeler trail & he slowly got up, and went across a bluff bank creek. Shot twice with 00 & broke 3 legs and my bro tackled him. This is where I learned the strength on a big bodied 1 legged deer.

I doubt it, his wound is from deflection, there was no penetration. First time I tried a BT and last time.

The one on the wall went down, then gotup and made it back into a cutover that was 5 years along. We tried to find it for him but if you have never tried going through a cutover like that in a Mississippi creek bottom that has numerous beaver ponds the vegitation is hard to explain except to plan on lots of crawling

Being the youngun of the group, I get sent off in that mess on hands and knees looking for any signs of recent activity and/or blood.

Deflection?

"First time I tried a BT and last time". Wow! That's not quite an extensive test, but it's his money to spend as he wishes. Like I said, I've shot hundreds of deer with the Ballistic Tip and I like the bullet just fine. That said, there are quite a few other bullets that I do like and use. I use the SST in the Grandson's 308. I use the 65 gr Sierra Gameking often in the 223. I used Remington factory ammo with CoreLokt bullets for years. I've used the Partition bullet. They all work fine. But, to get back to the Ballistic Tip, one of the reasons I like it is that it leaves a good blood trail. The deer don't all drop like a rock. A few years ago I shot a 260 pound 9 point in the heart/lung area and that big rascal managed to get about 50 yards into a huge thick briar patch. I tracked him just fine. This past year I shot 3 deer and maybe 10 or 15 hogs with Ballistic Tips and the furthest any of them ran was maybe 20 feet. That was with the 260 and the 120 grain BT. Range of shots was from 50 yards to 400 yards. I shoot em in the lungs. Most likely I'd have gotten exactly the same results with an SST, a CoreLokt, a Gameking, an Accubond, a Berger, or a Barnes. They'll all work for you. So shoot what you want at the deer, as long as it's not a varmint bullet, but don't blame bad bullet placement on the bullet.

There's no such thing as a magic bullet. They will all fail under certain circumstances, often for no logical reason. Use what you like and are confident in.

That's true, have seen a partition out of a 270roy hit shoulder plate of a hog and come out the top of its back...weird 90degree turn.

Now I did have a DRT out of my REM 7600 and a 165 BT. I could prop the deer back up and he would have been back in his tracks. That was one of the fastest kills I've had.

I don't know..those things are hit or miss. They shoot like match bullets though.

I think they are more consistent than most give credit for, the will always be a variable in the equation. One could shoot 4 similar sized animals at the same distance with the same bullet and shot placement and get varied results just from different rate in breathing, muscles being tense or relaxed or even bone density being slightly heavier or lighter. It sure seems the bonded and solid bullets take a lot of variables and makes them less effective on the outcome, they also allow the shooter to be less selective about shot placement (as in not worrying about bone/sholder as much) as one has to with BT or standard cup and core type bullets.

[quote=603Country]"First time I tried a BT and last time". Wow! That's not quite an extensive test, but it's his money to spend as he wishes. quote] Yeah I don't use deer as test subjects. In 42 years I have shot deer with coreloks, Win Power points, Siroccos, TSX, TTSX, Accubonds, GMK. A-Frames, Partitions,,,, There are probably several others. In that time I have taken 2-5 deer a year, and have never not recovered one I have hit, until I tried the BT. If I have an extensive ammount of experiece with other rounds and never had a problem, why would I want to continue testing on animals a round that has provided me with my first failure ever. I mean comeon it did not even break his shoulder just left him with a pretty long scar up his shoulder. The guy asked for opinions, I gave him one tried it didn't like it, won't use it again. And since when is a high shoulder shot bad bullet placement. I can promise you if I had shot him with a barnes, accubond, partition in the same spot we would not be having this discussion.

Chuck, sorry if I offended you but the original description of "He is still alive and has a big lump up and over the top of his left shoulder." sounded like numerous wounds that deer have recovered from and been killed later in life. A high shoulder shot that is just too high happens more often than anybody wants it to. Had one myself years ago with the only deer I ever killed with a 270. At the shot he dropped like a rock, couple minutes later he got up and started leaving the area, another shot low in the lungs put him down pretty quick. Does that make the 270 or the 130gr Sierra GameKing a bad choice? Nope bad shot on my part.

Same here, Chuck. Your note sounded like you just shot too high. And you did say that it didn't break his shoulder, which tells me where you shot him. Ballistic Tips do open up fast and a big bone could cause a failure to penetrate. And just like kmon1 did, I shot a huge 10 point across the top of the back and down he went. I got out the coffee and had a cup, waited 10 or 15 minutes and then started walking toward the buck. He twitched and kicked his back legs. Then he got up and ran off. I had hit him too high and nicked his spine (not fatally) and knocked him unconscious. I lost that one, but I don't think that I ever lost one that I hit properly with that BT. It's been many years and I just don't remember every deer. Probably one of my brothers or cousins would jump at the opportunity to say "I remember that 6 point that got away from ya, back in 1982.....".

No offense taken. I also stopped doing High Shoulder shots after that. My thinking is so what if I have to do some tracking. At least with a behind the shoulder shot, I know the deer is going to die and the chances for that happening again are much much lower. Switched to barnes, and so far they have all DRT, knock on wood. So while I agree no bullet is magical I am getting what I wanted from the barnes so far without wasting meat or worrying about deflections.
Back to the OP though, I did agree with the Accubond over the BT just through the Barnes out threw because I am having a really really good run with them.

I'm in agreement on the AccuBond. BTs at velocities that are moderate at impact work great. Push them hard within 200 yards may cause the bullet to fail. I have gone to premium bullets in my handloads to avoid the chance of a lost animal. I'm pushing the 120gr BTs pretty damn hard out of a 7mm-08 and tracked a doe that I shot at 87 yards bout 150 yards. Pass thru ( would love to see that bullet), but I suspect cup and core separation with that BT at that impact velocity.

I shot about every quality projectile I could find at deer,elk,&
pigs..not to mention varmits..I got off all Noslers..the partition were somewhat iffy on accuracy at range..I now use and
reload Barnes..one must keep a clean weapon, they are copper..and
you want to load a lighter wgt than usual because you'll get the
velocity and penatration..You probably will never recover a bullet, if you do wgt. it..My game bio buddy I reload his 25-06 w/100 grain TTSX and RL 22 gets in hole groups and shoots deer now out to and past 300 yds where he used to lose them at 80..
He got a Sendero/Zeiss combo..and never looked back..luck Don

100gr tsx out of a 257wby weighed 80gr when it was recovered out of a deer.

We've yet to recover a 110gr Accubond from the 25-06 running a mere 2800fps from 120lb deer to 250+lb pigs, been pleasantly pleased to say the least.

Not a huge sampling, but I've taken 3 deer and several pigs with 140gr, and almost as many 160gr, Accubonds with my .280AI.. Have yet to recover a bullet, and exits were large holes, massive internal trauma. Shots ranged from 30yds to 225yds. No discernible difference in bullet performance, though more animals fall DRT at the longer ranges. Never had to track an animal with it yet, the ones that have ran never made it to cover.

I've had similar results from a couple of other bullets/calibers, so I'm not touting it as the end all/be all of bullet design. But the 7mm Accubonds are good quality bullets in my experience.

I've switched just about everything over to them and have gotten others' rifles switched as well to consolidate bulk bullet orders. So far have yet to have one not perform correctly; mule deer, elk, hogs, WT. actually got pinholes through both shoulders of a deer last year just over 400, but internal damage was just awful. Wife's MD left a quarter size exit at about the same distance and insides were mush. Other bullets can & will do the same, but really liking how those fly long range.

I shot an aoudad in march with accubonds, can't think of a good enough reason to use bt...even for coyotes i always use the same load from my 300win mag..yes they may not expand quick enough in some cases, but everrything you shoot at will die...

If I may ask a question here.
Forgive my ignornce.
Is an Accubond, the same as core-loc.
If not, which is better on average weight Whitetail.
Thank you for the help.

No, they are not the same. Accubond is made by Nosler. Core Lokt is made by remington. The Accubond has a lead core that is chemically bonded to the jacket. The CoreLOkt, despite its name does not.

Have not read all the replies on purpose. I will not shoot any ballistic tips in a flat, fast cartridge for deer ever again. Too many deer lost due to lack of expansion, no matter the grain of bullet.

Lost due to lack of expansion from a Ballkstic tip,

Never lost anything hit with a Ballistic Tip bullet, but the complaints I have heard is too much expansion not too little.

Yelp corelokt has a crimp, so its basically a bt with out the tip and with a crimp

I have never shot a deer that did not run at least 150 yds with a Corelokt. I hate that cartridge. Now Honady Ballistic tips.......sweet usually DRT (Dead right there)

Core lokt is not a cartridge. It is the name that Remington calls the bullet design that they load in many different cartridges.

Ballistic Tip is a name for a bullet made by Nosler, not Hornady. Hornady makes a competing bullet...they call it the SST.


Gotta ask: how many deer have you shot with Core Lokts, and where did you hit them?

I was also wondering where he hit them with the Core Lokts. Back when I shot factory bullets, all I used were Remington CoreLokt and they worked just fine. There seems to be quite a few folks that hate 'this bullet' or 'that bullet', when in truth I think the bullets will all work acceptably as long as you don't shoot a deer with a varmint bullet and as long as you put the bullet where you should. If I couldn't use those Nosler BT's, I'd probably switch to the Hornady SST or the Sierra Gameking. Both of those have shown themselves to be extremely accurate in various rifles of mine. I probably would not buy the Nosler Accubond because of the cost. For whitetail deer, you really don't need the expensive bullets. Even expensive bullets won't compensate for poor shooting.

I would agree with that to some extent.

I have shot several different kinds of bullets and always killed what I was hunting with all of them, but some were more consistent than others.

With barnes and Hornady GMX's they worked well most of the time, but I also had severa instances where they didnt expand.

I shot hornady 150 grain interlocks in my 270 for 4 years and had big fluctuations in how they performed, always shot well, but one time they would pass through with a quarter to 1/2 dollar size exit(what I like) the next shot would blow a hole the size of a softball out the other side, and I had several instances where a 150 grain bullet at around 2700 fps out of a 270 win wouldnt pass through a hill country deer, all you would find on the inside was a mess of bullet fragments.

I shoot partitions and accubonds because they do the same thing every time I pull the trigger. Others did what I wanted some of the time, but Im willing to have a little extra cost to get the same result all the time.

Probably the factory ammo that I found to be the most consistent for me in on game performance was 130 grain rem corlocks in 270 win.

matt

[quote=JJH]Core lokt is not a cartridge. It is the name that Remington calls the bullet design that they load in many different cartridges.

Ballistic Tip is a name for a bullet made by Nosler, not Hornady. Hornady makes a competing bullet...they call it the SST.


Gotta ask: how many deer have you shot with Core Lokts, and where did you hit them? [/quote

Once it is loaded the complete round is called a cartridge, reguardless of bullet type. Ever look on the side of a millitary ammo can? It does not say 100 bullets or 100 rounds. It says 100 cartridges, then .50 cal or 9mm, then list the bullet type like ball or SLPT or FMJ.
I have shot 4 deer with Corelockt all behind the shoulder. Do not know how many of those were actual heart shots but the run like crazy part I remember well. Now the Hornady ballistic tip....yes yes, all tissues are not kleenex and all Q-tips are not Q-tip brand.......all behind shoulder and knees just buckle. I will NEVER hunt with Corelokt (AKA cheapest hunting ammo on market) again. You can kill a deer with a sling shot. It does not mean you should try.

To say all bullets are basically equal in killing effectiveness is the same as saying a .22 and a .300 Win. mag will all kill deer. True, but some do a better job than others.

Bullet is a component of a cartridge.

As to Hornady Ballistic Tip. Lets see a picture of the Box please.

Ballistic Tip is a trademarked name for one of Nosler's bullet product line and I think the first Poly carnonate tipped bullet by a major manufacture. Doubt you will ever see Hornady using that name.

Several years after the Nosler Ballistic Tip Bullets were introduced Hornady started with the SST which is also a polycarbonate tipped bullet. There are a few varities of the hunting ones there are the ones that use an interlock and some that do not. Hornady Interlock is just a small ring on the inside of the jacket ment to lessen the chance of core/jacket seperation.

Nosler and Hornady bullet companies started in different manners but both by men that were not satisfied with the current products available. John Nosler was not satisfied with the cup and core design of bullets after experiencing bullet fragmentation while on a Moose hunt, thus was born the Nosler Partition, and Nosler Bullet Company

Joyce Hornady was a target shooter that had a goal of single hole groups and believed he could make more accurate bullets than were available.

Both companies have done very well and we the shooters are both customers and benificiaries of those mens dilligence to make a better product and the resolve to do it.

Sigh......Kmon1, did you even read what I said about the Ballistic Tip reference to Hornady? Does it say on a Ammo can 100 Cartridges and their accompaning bullet, primer, powder, links componets? No. Knit picking a little there.
I do not care WHO owns a patent on what. All I know is a plastic tip (which most everyone calls a Baliistic Tip reguardless of maker) equals rapid expansion and serious knockdown power and that Corelokts suks!
Do you call all Q-tips Q-tips reguardless of maker? Yes you do. Do you call all Tissues Kleenex most likely. In Texas are all soda's cokes....yes. Stop taking yourselves so seriously there is no PRIZE !!!!!

I guess you call all trucks F150's, even if they are Silverados?

TF Panther, after giving your statement on killing effectiveness a little thought, I believe that you are right in that there probably are differences. Some will open up more or some less and such as that. Still, I do believe that if you took just about any bullet marketed by the big name bullet makers that are designed for what they term 'big game' and shot a whitetail deer through the lungs, you would very quickly have a dead deer. I think that I could take my 270 and just about anybody's 130 grain bullet (CoreLokt included) at or near 3000 fps and hunt happily and successfully for the rest of my life. I use the Ballistic Tip because they have worked extremely well for me for maybe 3 decades (since they came out), and I have a lot of them still in my loading boxes. And they shoot like match grade bullets.

What do you guys call Q-tips? Dupont ear swabs? No you do not now you are all as ignorant as me. How does it feel?

Listen "Experts".....I just call them trucks (you know a generic term) like you guys do! See the point Now? Ballistic Tip got the patent.....great. If Hornady could have called them Ballistic Tips they would have, but in order not to get sued they called them SST which have a Ballistic styled TIP!!!
You guys are arguing semantics. When someone says Ballistic Tip that have not been to the same expert bullet manufacturing course you all graduated from they mean a bullet with a plastic tip for rapid expansion, reguardless of manufacturer.
So sorry I do not meet all the Proffesional bullet makers standards here on the forum. I had no idea in order to say you do not like Corelokt and prefer Hornady Ballistic "styled" Tips or SST's I had to be judged by the guys who invented Black Powder.

Try logging on to a pickup truck lovers forum and telling them how much you love driving your Chevy F-150.

As far as the word Cartridge goes.....Call the Army and tell them they have been using the wrong word since the Civil War. Again semantics, but to you experts who live and die on such terms I will digress to keep your woodle hearts from breaking into. Is this the TFF or a high school drama website, with all your little snipping? I have Bieber tickets for sale JJH!

JJH So when you tell someone you left something in your________. Do you say A. Ford F-150 V-8 Ext Cab King Ranch edition or B. Truck.

corelokts and most non A frame cup and core bullets work great in medium velocity calibers, i.e. 30-30, 35 rem, et al. when you start getting into impact velocities over ~2600 fps you WILL start to experience core jacket seperations given enough chances at it. The big difference between Super Shock Tips and ballistic tips is the accuracy robbing cannelure on the SST and the BT has a tapered jacket

The only deer that I've ever shot and lost was with a 130 gr BT out of my 270. Might have been a fluke but I've been shooting Accubonds ever since and have had outstanding performance from them. Every deer that I've shot with my 280 using 140 gr Accubonds has dropped like they were struck by lightning.

might say "truck", might say "vehicle".

but if it was a truck I wouldn't say "car".

If it was a Lexus, I wouldn't say "Lincoln".

And unless I was really ignorant, I wouldn't mix the right brand with the wrong model.

until the US .30 cal of 1903 ctg us army ctgs were named by thier calibre-blackpowder charge- bullet weight, 45-70-500

JJH. If were were talking guns and I said my "AR" would you know what I was talking about or would you stare at me like a 16 YO boy who just saw his first set of boobs and have to wait until I said, Oh sorry, A 5.56mm, 16 inch CMMG barrel Chrome Molly chamber, with Mag Pull furniture, a DPMS barrel and SOG Lower before you knew what I was talking about?

and now the army names ctgs by caliber and bullet type and ctg designation like the .30 m72 NM or 5.56X45 Ball m855

Semantics.

either that or the difference between someone who knows of which he speaks and someone who does not

Sigh....it still says 100 Cartridges. Along with .50 SLPT or whatever as of 2006 anyway. It does or did not say 100 brass cases filled with powder loaded with a .50 Cal SLPT bullet manufactured by whoever. So as I said. Semantics.

I can read hero!

If all you said was "AR", I would have a general idea about the type of weapon that you have. If we were on a guns/hunting forum, and you were touting that your AR was somehow better than someone else's, I would need more data to understand your position. If you used incorrect nomenclature to describe your AR, I would have some idea as to how well-informed you were.

You do get the point then. This is not a contest. That was my point. I did not committ a sin which will expedite me straight to TFF hel l for my use of the term Ballistic Tip. You do not have to be a ballistic geek to have an opinion on a round. Have a good night.

I thought this was the THF

What point? You came to a "ballistic geek" webite and used technically incorrect language. You were corrected on it and got your panties in a wad.

If you want to talk about Hornady Ballistic Tips to your coffee shop buddies, it's probably not gonna be an issue.

But if you go to a forum of folks who have a passion for a particular avocation, you will need to be informed enough to not make ignorant comments, or you will have to expect to be corrected.

I'm already having a good night!

LOL, My My. I never claimed to be an expert. I never stated I know more about bullets than anyone in the world. I never said "I am an expert and can testify in court on the subject".

I gave my OPINION between Hornady and Corelokt. I said I did not like the Corlokt Cartridge. Someone tried to correct me on that as well. Websters defines Cartridge as, A case (often metal) containing a complete charge for a firearm. A complete charge would also need a bullet so yes I am correct on that. Once fired it would be a spent cartridge or spent case.

When I said Hornady "Ballistic Tip" everyone knew I was speaking about the SST. Why? Because Hornady designed the SST to be excactly like the Ballistic Tip with just enough variation as to not get sued. Everyone knew what I was talking about yet as "Experts" you lost your collective minds and started acting like kids on a play ground in an unwelcome attempt to belittle me as I could not possibly have a coherent thought because I made a slight deviation in the nomenclature as "coffee shop guys will do". I fail to see how that was an arrogant comment but your response was extremely arrogant!

Please regail me with all the bullets you have designed since you are basicaly claiming you are an expert. How many patents do you have? Can you testify in court as an"expert witness" on bullets? No? Oh, so you are just like me then...........

Oh good one! Yeah, you really showed me. LOL, yes yes sorry I am also a member of the Texas Fishing Forum or TFF. Yes that typo is proof of your intellectual superiority. Try a yahoo search for Civil War gattlin gun cartridge. Guess they are wrong too because they have them listed.....as a cartridge! Then you can contact them and tell them the military did not have cartridges during the civil war and that you know this because you are an expert.

Care again to tell me there was no cartridge in the Civil War?

Have a cup of coffee. You'll feel better.

Your reference to anything having a plastic tip being a Ballistic Tip is like saying every soft lead tip bullet is a Lebel. You're generalizing it too much yes they are similar in they gave a plastic tip but are different in other areas meaning they aren't the same same goes for saying the Accubond, Interbond or Scirroco's are the same as well since they all have a polymer tip as well.

Yes, Honrady makes the SST. Anyone who refers to the plastic tip bullet design as anything other than the exact nomenclature per each manufacturer (reguardless if the manufacturer was listed) should be ridiculed.

Good thing no 2 manufacturers have the boat tail design, otherwise we would never be able to tell what someone is talking about. LOL.

I am one of you guys now. Corlokt is the best bullet ever and performs just as good as the Hornady SST.

Id ask if it was a recliner or not

But seriously sst and bt and accubonds and interbonds and sirrocos and ttsxs and hornady gmx's and nosler e-tips all have little "balistic plastic tips" on them, yet none of them are they same... but I guess they are all fired from guns to shoot stuff so we should call them all balistic tips right?

Quit being a jackleg, if your not going to contribute then leave.

NOSLER bt's/ct and similar family better know as cup and core
Hornady sst, vmax, varmint, amax, spire point
Serria GK, blitz king, pro hunter, mk, varminter
Berger vld, fb, bt


Crimped cup and core bullets
Remmy corelokt, hornady interlock

Chemically Bonded bullet family
swift Scirocco II
Nosler ab
Hornady interbond
Corelokt ultra bonded

3 Section bullets
Nosler Partition
Swift A frame


Monolithic bullets
Barnes
Nosler et
Hornady gmx

My experience and IMO
Stay away from the cup and core & crimped in any thing under .27 cal, over a mv of 3300+, or unless it ultra long range (500+yards).

I feel the monolithic type bullets are a game changer in hot smaller calibers, 22-250,243,6mm, .224 ttha, 220swift, 25-06, 257wby. I think they have raised there big game effectiveness up tremendously. You push a cup/core bullet ultra fast you rolling the dice wether the bullet construction will not be compromised at impact.

Over .27 I don't think it really matters.

My 2cent for what its worth

Red Chevy,

Wow, you mean some bullets are different? Oh my, I am learning so much. Huh, so when Hornady created their SST they did not copy the design from Ballistic Tip and make some variations as not to get sued? I had no idea the SST is not a Ballistic Tip design? Where did they get the idea?

Some of us refer to AR add on's as furniture.....at least at the coffee shop. Not being an "expert" like yourself I appreciate yet another correction, and I will let the boys know you do not approve and do so in a condesending manner like you did. How do I get myself dressed in the morning?

My OPINION before everyone put on their self proclaimed expert hats was.....Corlokts are not good. Yes they will kill a deer, at least eventually for me, then again so will a rock. I like (Opinion) Hornady SST, you know the one with the Ballistic Tip design that they copied from Ballistic Tip and everyone somehow knew what I was talking about before they felt compelled to show me up. I like them because in my OPINION they perform better when deer hunting for me.

Now you guys can go back to stroking each others ballistic ego's and wait for another guy to come in and use a term you do not like and then get 'em.

Yeah, I am the Jackleg. The Jackleg meter in here is pegged and when I leave the needle will not move.

TF

panties still in a wad, huh? Well, I'd love to try to help. But I'm headed to the range to try out my new Remington M70, 300 Winchester SAUM. I've loaded up some Honrady GameKings to try.

Misinformation helps nobody..... If you gave someone the Hornady BT advice that knew no difference and that person headed to the store to by Hornady ammo what's to stop them from buying a vmax and ruining their hunting experience?

Oh and i agree Core-Lokt bullets aren't great although they manage to take a good amount of game each year. The question would be how many are admittedly lost due to them.

Hey JJH are you riding in your new F150 silverado with the Hemi? Man that truck is awsome!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, keep stroking each other until there is no one willing to comment in here due to the "experts" like Red Chevy and JJH. Yuck Yuck Ford with a Hemi. Oh the humanity for refering to the SST as a Ballistic Tip even though it is a copied Ballistic Tip design. It is not like I was giving my opinion on Ballistic coefficients. Just an OPINION between Corlokt and Hornady in which EVERYONE knew exactly what I was saying.

I could be a qualified expert on a weapon system but if I called the forward assist, the assist button I suddenly become a mouth breather who is not entitled to an opinion about the weapon. Pathetic. Enjoy your little circle.......

They might be raggin on you a bit, but you did bring it on yourself. This is one of those times that you need to take the wise path and quit while you're behind.

The problem is not everyone knows the SST is the counterpart of the Nosler Ballistic Tip and half of Hornadys darn bullets come with a polymer tip not just the SST. It has no bearing whether it was copied or not they simply aren't the same thing, It's like calling a Springfield 1903 a Mauser 98 sure they are really close a Mauser sued Springfield over the similarity but they aren't the same.